Mafia 13 game [TOWN WINS!]

Anatoly · 2017-08-11 10:07:59

Before we even start with RNG again (what we hopefully won't):

We have to answer this questions:

Who was the victim?
Who was attacking today?
Who will be next Victim

I am pretty sure now that Luka504 is Doctor, so there is a problem: Will he heal himself or will he heal someone else? The point is, that we also know AlphaJon is RoleBlocker. So one of them will be for sure attacked by Mafia. I'd also say Processor is a townie, and that's why he completely lost interest in the game.

I got some shortcuts questions:

#203, #205: "FFs Luka." - Devlin

What's FF?

#224 "+role card"

What he tries to say with it?

#231 "DQ"

What's an DQ?

#247

What's a Mafia Trvial? (English vocabulary)

Also depending on what we know so far is:

My Theories:

JaWapa attacked Devlin
JaWapa attacked anyone
Somebody else attacked Devlin

Sources & Log:

203 – JaWapa votes for Luka, and says that me and Devlin are Mafia, suggests to lynch us in any order
212 – JaWapa gives advice for the Doctor to spawn.
213 – Luka504 healt Devlin
213 – Luka504 thinks JaWapa is Mafia, doesn't vote
217 – Devlin knew facts from sapizza. But he continued playing "without" them, so JaWapa is his victim (Take also care JaWapa voted for this) -> That means that JaWapa is not Mafia, and votes against him are useless.
225 – AlphaJon says, that Devlin is no reason to be attacked, and someone else was attacked, so from my theories (above this list class), it would be the second one, which isn't as same as 217 (above bullet point), that means
226 – MrJaWapa says Devlin is Mafia, so we get a problem: Devlin was healed, and (seems like) attacked by Jawa. Jawa was roleblocked by 227, so everything Jawa told us were lies, and in fact Devlin and Luka aren't Mafia.
227 – AlphaJon tells his role: RoleBlocker; votes for Jawa
228
231, 232, 234, 235 – hummerz5, Slabdrill, jkdrip, Onjit say it is JaWapa
239 – Evilbunny unvotes
240 – jkdrip unvotes
241 – Evilbunny creates a list of his "Mafias"
241 – Jawa says it's me; doesn't vote
244 – jkdrip creates his own mafias list; double posts: Votes for Luka.
249 – Creates his Mafia List, also tripple posting is not allowed per the forums rules.

Onjit wrote:

Right now we have two main stories:
Luka (doctor) protected Devlin
and
AlphaJon (roleblocker) blocked Jawapa

Actually we got a 3rd story: Nobody was killed during Night. That means Luka had healed the right one, or Jawa was indeed roleblocked.

mutantdevle · 2017-08-11 10:27:29

Okay this is my beginning of the day long post. I'll start with my defence on Jawapa's claims and then address my thoughts on the night results and what has been said since.

Response to Jawapa:

▼Hidden text

MrJaWapa wrote:

if I'm wrong I'll cry actual tears.

Start crying.

MrJaWapa wrote:

The RNG put Luka under a lot of pressure, and caused him to make a lot of slips.

I don't think they're slips, just him being salty.

MrJaWapa wrote:

For starters, he made a wild claim as the doctor. It was just an attempt to relieve the pressure off of him. The bit of doubt people had caused them to remove their votes.
"Not to save me or anything. I just want the mafia to target me so I don't survive the night." - Luka

I do think his intention is to die because he doesn't want to play. But whilst he is still willing to use his night action he is worth keeping alive.

MrJaWapa wrote:

Luka went on a rant, and made a couple slips:
"Devlin don't act dumb someone already told you my role remember?" - Luka
This was followed by:
"FFs Luka." - Devlin
Devlin was aware of the slips.

This has been explained. I was just aware of his idiocracy.

MrJaWapa wrote:

"Sorry Devlin but I cant be bothered. I consider you and Anatoly town and everyone else is a scum." - Luka
Subtle game throwing?

I was trying to get him to play the game, clearly he doesn't want to. It's not my fault if he considers the only 2 people who don't agree with RNG lynches to be town.

MrJaWapa wrote:

On top of Luka saying those two were town, and everyone else was scum, anatoly made this slip:
"I am completely at Luka's protection..." - Anatoly

It would appear that Anatoly also finds RNG votes as stupid, I doubt it is anything more than that.

MrJaWapa wrote:

While Luka was on the chopping block, Devlin was trying really hard to steer everyone away from an RNG lynch. EB was catching a little heat, so he tried making an excuse to lynch him, instead of Luka.
"Also @Luka I'm hoping this is going to be a you or Evilbunny vote so I guess that means you gotta side with me." - Devlin
This was to allow Luka to vote for EB without it looking like he was blindly following Devlin.
"Slabdrill since you unvoted Luka can you at least put your vote on Evilbunny if only for now" - Devlin
Really started pushing for EB.

At the time I considered Evilbunny the most suspicious out of the 2 other people from Luka who had votes. They were the easiest target to shift focus away from Luka who I believed was unfairly targetted by a RNG. At least there was some points against Evilbunny even if they were stupid ones. Since it was D1 we could really only have stupid reasons to vote for someone and I consider voting for someone for stupid reasons better than voting for someone for no reason otherthan they are unlucky. Unlucky reveals nothing about your role whereas stupid reasons at least have a more opinionated chance of catching Mafia. I'd no longer support any lynch on Evilbunny as they are one of the only people I consider confirmed town at this point.

MrJaWapa wrote:

"Also @Jawapa if you don't side with me here I'm going to be very disappointed." - Devlin
Of course he would be disappointed if I kept making a push on his teammate.

Why do you think I appealed to you specifically there? I could have told anyone I'd be disappointed if they don't vote for Evilbunny but I chose you. The reason being is because I thought you hadn't voted yet and you just seemed like a person who is likely to see my way of thinking. Obviously not. And I must tell you that I am indeed disapointed with you.

MrJaWapa wrote:

Devlin's push on EB backfired, and he started taking on votes instead.
"The only way I would be scum right now is if Luka is scum and I don't think anyone thinks Luka is actually scum right?" - Devlin
"I'm desperate now, and I know it's strategical not to and doing so may harm the town, I'm going to be selfish here and vote for Luka just because he is the only person I can see getting lynched to save myself sad sorry Luka." - Devlin
Devlin was scared, and wanted to make it look like he and Luka were not tied together. He voted for Luka, because mafia would never vote for one of their own - right?

How stupid do you think I am? Your last comment almost makes me feel insulted. And I'm glad that you genuinely believe that Luka is scum because otherwise your points against me would mean nothing.

MrJaWapa wrote:

It doesn't matter what order they're lynched. I'm starting with Luka, because he was already called upon by fate.

Yeah sure let's kill the doctor. Screw health care am I right?

MrJaWapa wrote:

If a real doctor steps forward, we know Luka is lying.

Erm no we don't... this is a closed game remember? It isn't likely but there could be multiple doctors. For all we know every power role we have could be a doctor. I doubt this is the case though.

MrJaWapa wrote:

If there is a real doctor, now is a good time to speak up.
If there is a roleblocker, and you RB'd Luka last night, now is a good time to speak up.
In any case, I think lynching Luka would be an okay move. If he turns out to be mafia, then we can follow up by lynching Devlin/Anatoly. If he turns out to be town, we didn't lose anyone important.

MrJaWapa wrote:

If a real doctor steps forward, we know Luka is lying.

This is terrible just terrible advice... "hey everyone let's just expose all our power roles so that the Mafia know who to kill!". Also there is a strong chance Luka is the doctor and you don't consider that important? Shame on you.

AlphaJon wrote:

Well, I believe you're mafia, JaWapa, because I roleblocked you tonight.

You just fell for Jawapa's trap... I don't think revealing your role was the wisest thing to do but good can come of it since now there is more support for lynching Jawapa. Furthermore more have just gone from being the most suspicious player to me to a confirmed Townie so I guess that was good also.

Also Jawapa gets role blocked and there is no kill night 1, sound familiar? I think history might be repeating itself here.

MrJaWapa wrote:

Whether gosha is maf or not, he's incapable of hurting the town... he's incapable of doing anything. I guess we could lynch him for the hell of it.

No, just no. Stop. Why are you so full of bad ideas today? Lynching someone without letting them defend themselves is never okay unless they are purposely staying quiet. Gosha clearly can't defend himself due to his ban and hence it is completely unfair to lynch him.

Honestly Jawapa within these messages you have changed my mind from doubting my suspicions of you to considering you the most scum like in AlphaJon's place. Everything you have suggested we do will have a negative impact on the town. But hey, at least if we lynch Luka it would clear my name and expose you as Mafia, do you really want that?

My thoughts on the night:

Well that was honestly the best possible result we could have asked for! I thought I'd screwed the town a little bit when the day ended in a no lynch but in actuality it was perfect. We are in exactly the same position as D1 player wise except now we have information on people both from what they have been saying and how the PR's have had a chance to investigate people.

We now have 2 possibilites here. Either Jawapa is Mafia and was role blocked by AlphaJon or the Mafia tried to kill me and Luka saved me. So let's take this one at a time:

IF the first possibility is true then it means Jawapa is Mafia. That is some solid evidence against Jawapa and a good strong reason to have him lynched.
Alternatively IF the Mafia did attempt to kill me then we have to ask ourselves why? What would make me a target?

AlphaJon wrote:

Luka said he healed Devlin, which makes me believe it was indeed a roleblock, because I don't see mafia targeting Devlin.

I very much agree with this. I really don't see why it would be a good idea to shoot me. Most players were fairly suspicious of me so surely it would be a good idea to keep me alive as a lynch option. This makes me believe that I would have only been a target if the Mafia wanted to silence me. They'd only want to silence me if I was on the right track as to who was Mafia. The people I mainly called out as potential Mafia were Slabdrill, jkdrip, diff, jawapa and AlphaJon. We can elliminate AlphaJon since he role claimed leaving just the other 4.
The fact that Luka healed me reinforces the idea that it was infact a role block that prevented last nights kill. If this is the case we lynch jawapa.
If it was instead my head that was destined for a bullet, then that would mean jawapa is still a potential scum. Personally I think if it was Luka's heal that prevented the kill then the most likely person to be Mafia, out of the 4, would be Slabdrill. But since In 1 scenario jawapa has a 100% probabilty of being Mafia and in the other he has a theoretical 25% chance of being Mafia, I think lynching jawapa would be a good use of the lynch today.

Evilbunny wrote:

I don't know what to think about luka and devlin any more.

Luka is almost definately the doctor. The information he gave about his role and his results seems too acurate to be lying. If Luka is town then I'm hoping that also clears my name since my main crime seems to be defending him. I strongly consider you town now so you don't have to worry about me making any pushes against you. Instead, if you come under fire, unless the reason is valid, I will defend you as aggresively as I defended Luka.

I'd also like to say that as you may know from previous games and this one, as well as what you will learn from future games, is that I will aggresively defend anyone I think is either strongly town or being attacked for a stupid reason. The 3 main stupid reasons I consider are: victim of RNG, not saying much and is a noob. I don't think any of those are valid reasons by themselves to warrent a lynch. They can be used as evidence to support other reasons but if they are the only reason the player is being lynched I will defend them.

hummerz5 wrote:

hey guys again can I motion to throw out any talk of role cards?
Besides, giving the dictionary definition as we have makes confirmation by mafia trivial. Google word. Check definition. First to claim wins gold medal.

Can I have my gold medal now please?

Seriously though I agree with your statement. Once I gave the definition like that it would have been fairly easy for anyone to find the word and hence everyone now knows the final word on the role card. Therefore stating you know it does not clear you as Town. Besides, for all we know the Mafia role card could end something like 'you win when all threats to the Mafia are eliminated'. So it doesn't really prove anything.

Onjit wrote:

This raises a few questions:
1) Who was the mafia's target?
2) Are either of these claims true, and if so, which one?

Well I think that both are true it's just that only one could have had an effect. Tbh they could both be true again. For example if jawapa tried to kill me but was role blocked by AlphaJon.

AnatolyEE wrote:

I got some shortcuts questions:
#203, #205: "FFs Luka." - Devlin
What's FF?

FFS means for **** sake.

AnatolyEE wrote:

226 – MrJaWapa says Devlin is Mafia, so we get a problem: Devlin was healed, and (seems like) attacked by Jawa. Jawa was roleblocked by 227, so everything Jawa told us were lies, and in fact Devlin and Luka aren't Mafia.

It would appear so yes.

AnatolyEE wrote:

249 – Creates his Mafia List, also tripple posting is not allowed per the forums rules.

Double and triple posting rules on the forums do not apply to Mafia games fyi (for your interest).

Onjit wrote:

Also, I'm not sure if either of them have been online, but what specifically was shared between Luka and Sapizza and Devlin?

Personally I do think Maxi should post the screenshots that I sent him or at the very least just the first one where Sapizza tells me what he does. Because whilst what he told me isn't much it does have a small effect and I think everyone has the right to know all the information as it is unfair that only I have that. @Maxi I'd encourage you to share what I was told but it's your game and your rules so your choice.

So inconclusion, no matter what the cause of the no night kill was, jawapa is a potential threat in one and a confirmed threat in the other. I think it is fair to say that if anything, jawapa is the most likely person to be Mafia based on the information we currently have. Now we must decide if we wait for the cop to investigate jawapa at the end of this day to confirm our theories or if we should lynch him today for being the most likely candidate.

I personally think we should lynch him today so for now:

!vote MrJawapa

Here are also my general reads:

Gosha - Uknown, probably Town.
MrJaWapa - Scum.
hummerz5 - Strong Town.
Different55 - Unsure.
jkdrip - Unsure.
Slabdrill - Suspicious.
luka504 - Doctor.
Evilbunny - Strong Town.
AlphaJon - Role Blocker.
Onjit - Town.
AnatolyEE - Strong Town.
Processor - Town.

Devlin - As Diff said, I am Satan.

Maxi - Please share info.

Onjit · 2017-08-11 10:34:10

What's the current votecount? I'm going to vote Jawapa but I don't want to take it to Hammertown.

Anatoly · 2017-08-11 10:37:03

Devlin wrote:

IF the first possibility is true then it means Jawapa is Mafia. That is some solid evidence against Jawapa and a good strong reason to have him lynched.
Alternatively IF the Mafia did attempt to kill me then we have to ask ourselves why? What would make me a target?

Lets don't exclude:

JaWapa is Mafia, but didn't do the kill (what actually could make both statements true).

Devlin wrote:

IF the Mafia did attempt to kill me then we have to ask ourselves why?

It looks like RNG. I'm not sure, but RNG would be best explanation.

mutantdevle · 2017-08-11 10:37:34

Jawapa and Luka have 2 votes each.

I'd unvote in an instant if jawapa gets too close to a lynch though. We have time and we don't need to waste it.

Onjit

mutantdevle · 2017-08-11 10:38:47

AnatolyEE wrote:

Devlin wrote:
IF the Mafia did attempt to kill me then we have to ask ourselves why?
It looks like RNG. I'm not sure, but RNG would be best explanation.

I'd disagree. Mafia kills are almost never RNG as it would be unwise for them to do that.

Onjit

Anatoly · 2017-08-11 10:43:48

Devlin wrote:

AnatolyEE wrote:
Devlin wrote:
IF the Mafia did attempt to kill me then we have to ask ourselves why?
It looks like RNG. I'm not sure, but RNG would be best explanation.
I'd disagree. Mafia kills are almost never RNG as it would be unwise for them to do that.

But if Mafia in fact chose you? What will be a followed theory then? JaWapa told multiply times that me, you and Luka are Mafia. That means that we will be in fact Mafia, right?

Onjit · 2017-08-11 10:48:08

It seems like it'd be pretty foolish for the mafia to use RNG, there's no benefit to them strategically.
Usually the meta for mafia choosing who to kill is: PRs > Vocal players > Lurkers

I find it more likely that they would have targeted Luka, who admitted to being the doctor D1 iirc.

hummerz5

Anatoly · 2017-08-11 10:49:30

Onjit wrote:

It seems like it'd be pretty foolish for the mafia to use RNG, there's no benefit to them strategically.

I'm not getting it. Jawa used to start RNG elimination on D1

mutantdevle · 2017-08-11 10:49:35

AnatolyEE wrote:

But if Mafia in fact chose you? What will be a followed theory then? JaWapa told multiply times that me, you and Luka are Mafia. That means that we will be in fact Mafia, right?

No. If Jawapa is accusing us of being Mafia and then turns out to be Mafia it would mostly clear our names since if he was Mafia he would want to accuse town members as Mafia to get them lynched and tell us Mafia members are town to protect them.

Anatoly · 2017-08-11 10:51:29

Devlin wrote:

AnatolyEE wrote:
But if Mafia in fact chose you? What will be a followed theory then? JaWapa told multiply times that me, you and Luka are Mafia. That means that we will be in fact Mafia, right?
No. If Jawapa is accusing us of being Mafia and then turns out to be Mafia it would mostly clear our names since if he was Mafia he would want to accuse town members as Mafia to get them lynched and tell us Mafia members are town to protect them.

Okay, got it. But we still got no answers to:

How many mafia's exist?
Who are his teammates?

We could answer it if we would know whome Jawa had protected.

Onjit · 2017-08-11 10:52:19

AnatolyEE wrote:

Onjit wrote:
It seems like it'd be pretty foolish for the mafia to use RNG, there's no benefit to them strategically.
I'm not getting it. Jawa used to start RNG elimination on D1

We used RNG because we didn't have any information

The mafia has all the information, so they would want to use the kill properly

mutantdevle · 2017-08-11 10:52:38

In most games there are 3 Mafia members. If Jawapa is Mafia then I think we should look into Diff since they have a slight connection through their constant agreement but other than that idk.

Anatoly · 2017-08-11 10:55:52

Can it be that Processor is a townie or detective (if detective exists). He is in the background and spying.

mutantdevle · 2017-08-11 10:58:41

AnatolyEE wrote:

Can it be that Processor is a townie or detective (if detective exists). He is in the background and spying.

Possibly, but I think I may know who the cop / detective is if there is one. I don't want to call them out on it because I don't want the Mafia to suspect them.

Anatoly · 2017-08-11 11:00:59

Devlin wrote:

AnatolyEE wrote:
Can it be that Processor is a townie or detective (if detective exists). He is in the background and spying.
Possibly, but I think I may know who the cop / detective is if there is one. I don't want to call them out on it because I don't want the Mafia to suspect them.

I'd woot you, but I already had enough for today.

Anatoly · 2017-08-11 12:40:10

Ill go so do not expect me talking until evening. (in my time zone)

Harmonious · 2017-08-11 13:21:00

Since I'm unsure of voting for Luka or Jawa, I suppose it makes the most sense to not vote the guy that might be our doctor.
!unvote

Doesn't mean I don't think Luka is maf. We just need to confirm either Alpha's role claim or Luka's. This is best done with a Jawa vote.
!vote Jawa

hummerz5 · 2017-08-11 13:35:20

Onjit wrote:

As for what the setup is, to answer Hummerz's question

very much appreciated. So you're saying a vig might very well have waited on n1 so they aren't hunted down? Is that good strategy? also thanks for posting

mr proc where art thou

I think there's a third possibility in the mrjawapa/alphajon gambit but it seems unlikely.

Devlin wrote:

If Jawapa is Mafia then I think we should look into Diff since they have a slight connection through their constant agreement but other than that idk.

this is a good point. I noticed that as well. It's loose but there.

Harmonious · 2017-08-11 13:52:40

What's the 3rd possibility? Luka and Dev both maf or something?

Harmonious · 2017-08-11 13:53:11

Sorry, meant Luka and Alpha. Big difference there.

AlphaJon · 2017-08-11 14:02:29

About the night feedback, I asked maxi during D1, and he said that noone can know if he was roleblocked.

mutantdevle · 2017-08-11 14:06:23

AlphaJon wrote:

About the night feedback, I asked maxi during D1, and he said that noone can know if he was roleblocked.

Thought so, since that's how it tends to work in most games.

So it is perfectly valid that Jawapa was unaware that he was role blocked if he was Mafia. Furthermore, if both Luka saved me and Jawapa targeted me for the night kill then perhaps Jawapa was assuming he wasn't the target of the role block when he called for the role blocker to reveal them self.

AlphaJon · 2017-08-11 14:12:46

Despite the eliminated text, I still think JaWapa has to be lynched today.
IMO, those here who made readlists are putting people on the town side too easily. We are D2, noone is supposed to put in 5 people as town.
The low-posters are an annoying thing. How are we supposed to play if we have several people not even participating apart from the occasional 2 posts before going away again?

Harmonious

Harmonious · 2017-08-11 14:33:26

Here's the current vote count. If I missed something correct me.
[3] Jawa - jkdrip, Alpha, Dev
[1] Luka - JaWa

I'd also appreciate it more if people in general would just put their vote out there. That'd tell the rest of us where their mind is at. Or maybe you have a good reason not to idk

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