Mafia 36 [KIRBY WINS!]

Onjit · 2019-11-26 13:25:29

Welcome to Mafia 36!

Rules

1. Respect everyone, it's just a game, don't be a jerk.
2. Do not gamethrow. Play your role to win even if it seems dire, you never know what might happen.
3. Only discuss the game in this thread, or threads I assign to you.
4. Dead men tell no tales. Please use the graveyard thread if you have been eliminated.
5. Make all night actions via PM to me.
6. Don't use the mod text color please.
7. Try to post at least once every 24 hours.
8. Days will last 72 hours, nights will last 24 hours.
9. If you break the rules I will be rather ornery.
10. Have fun!

Setup

Shhhhhh it's a secret! Moving along...

End Game

The game will end when someone wins.

Players

ShadowsEdge
Slabdrill Luka504
mutantdevle
Different55
ZeldaXD

Graveyard

KirbyKareem (Brother In Arms) - Lynched Day 1
Kirby (Kira (no the other one)) - Killed Night 1
Kira (Mafia Blocker) - Lynched Day 2
mrjawapa (Epidemiologist) - Killed Night 2
Crybaby (Mafia Defender) - Lynched Day 3
NorwegianboyEE (Innocent Child) - Killed Night 3
peace (Mafia Role Cop) - Lynched Day 5
Pqwerty(Hitman) - Lynched Day 6

ShadowsEdge · 2019-11-27 01:19:32

Yo what up. I saw the thread opened in the morning, but I fell asleep because I just got back from my trip. So sorry for posting late.

Sorry for grammatical errors here, Im trying to type quick because my computer is at 1% and I lost my charger during the trip so I only have 4 minutes to type this entire post k thanks.

**** phase is kinda stupid, but I see where everyone is going with the whole idea that Kirbykareem is suspicious because they were trying to vote for a confirmed IC. But considering last game, I doubt they actually look at the OP or anything pertaining to the setup unless they're asked to. With that said, I just think it's a mistake on Kirbykareem's part, although I don't believe that makes him town.

Hesitant to believe that confirms Mutant as town, but I suppose.

Alright sorry y'all I don't got a lot of time because my computer is about to die. I'll try posting on my phone if needed.

ShadowsEdge · 2019-11-28 03:04:28

Ok so I have a charger once again and now my computer is no longer dead!

Best reasoning I have for KK not unvoting for you Norwegian is that he forgot he voted for you. Although, considering it's been mentioned multiple times I'm doubting that now.

Also for a second I forgot that Kirby was in here so now there's a Kirby and KirbyKareem, I'm gonna get so confused when reading this.

Also, just want to point out that Kira seems to be trying to get a read on Norwegian, despite them being confirmed as town:

Kira wrote:

NorwegianboyEE wrote:
!Vote Kirby
Why are you voting Kirby?

Sorry I don't have a whole lot to say. Not voting for either Peace or KirbyKareem yet (Since I assume they're the likely candidates for today), mainly because I want discussion time to ensue, as many have pointed out.

ShadowsEdge · 2019-11-28 19:48:33

I think that Crybaby is scummy because Crybaby is playing differently this game. Has he articulated any idea that he would be inactive this game?

I checked his iso, and his only two posts is in response to a mod post by Onjit, confirming Norwegian as Town. And then voting for KirbyKareem.

In my opinion, Crybaby seems more like a Jester, since as Mafia, knowing KirbyKareem is town, they wouldn't make themself so suspicious by hammering him, and as town I feel that they would have stated more of a reason to why they voted for KirbyKareem.

Only issue with this is, I don't know if Jester actually exists.

ShadowsEdge · 2019-11-28 20:10:40

NorwegianboyEE wrote:

If Crybaby is either jester or town then he's no trouble. Might i remind you that Crybaby played a extremely crappy towngame back in mafia 33 where all he did was **** and troll? I think Crybaby puts in a whole lot more effort as scum ironically enough. So the fact that he's basically done nothing other than read the game and lolhammer gives me better vibes here.

True. It's not impossible for Crybaby to be scum, I just think that it's most likely that Crybaby is Jester, specifically because of the way they're playing, and I wanted to point it out.

Kira wrote:

Reason why I wanted to know his role was exactly because I feared this might happen and we could've easily prevented it, but you guys chose to hammer it... Let's use the 2 confirmed townies to our advantage and communicate, unless y'all want to throw the game like everytime

Why do you say "You guys chose to hammer it," Crybaby was the one who hammered it.

As for why we "hammered" it, I think you're referring to the speed which the wagon was built. In my opinion, the reason why the wagon built so quickly was because it was supported by Norwegian, town players easily followed it because they trusted Norwegian as confirmed town, and Mafia knowing that KirbyKareem is town followed the wagon, not having to push it because it's already supported by Norwegian.

I don't mean to use this to blame Norwegian for the course of events, but be aware of the effect you have on the town, Norwegian.

Kira wrote:

idk man this happens every single time we cant have a single good game where people are willing to communicate together

That's because we can't trust everyone in Mafia. It's all about deception, we can have conversation, but we can't all communicate together completely, because our opinions can be affected by the mafia. The only people we can trust right now are Norwegian and Zelda, assuming KirbyKareem flips Mason. But other than that, no one else can be trusted. That's the reason that people aren't "willing to communicate together."

ShadowsEdge · 2019-11-28 20:38:27

NorwegianboyEE wrote:

That's some BS lol. People should try to analyze people and find out who's looking the most town and who's looking the most scum. Not just fall back on the confirmed townies and assume they know everything. In fact it might be harder for me to get a read on people because nobody will ever try to misrepresent my arguments because they already know they can't disprove the fact that i'm town and nothing they say will convince people otherwise so they'll most likely try to avoid engaging me at all if it can be helped.

Well yeah, that is something they should be doing. But Kira said that they're not communicating together. And the reason for that is because we can't trust everyone. Everyone holds information to themselves until its best to reveal it, because they cant trust everyone with it. Even with having confirmed players, that's only to reference ideas, because we cant tell people information directly, it has to be said publicly, and because of that, some people stay quiet and just keep their information to themselves. That's my whole point with the "people aren't willing to communicate together" bit.

And yeah, people should use confirmed townies as a reference, but confirmed townies have a higher effect than anyone in the town, they can influence everyone's opinions, because even though they can be wrong, their reads are 100% confirmed to be of town intention, which leads people to believe their reads more, even if their reads aren't what we believe ourself. Furthermore, because of the influence confirmed townies have, if they're wrong, the Mafia can easily push their ideology, because it's the will of someone with town intentions.

And yeah, I do agree that it's a lot harder for you. But to everyone, just because Norwegian is town doesn't mean you cant argue with his opinions, Norwegian is confirmed town, but he can also be wrong in his opinions and make mistakes, just like the rest of us. Which is what I think Norwegian is trying to put across everyone.

ShadowsEdge · 2019-11-28 20:39:34

Different55 wrote:

In a real town they wouldn't just pack up, end discussion, and go to bed because for a brief moment there was a majority. It's only done in the game to save time but that adds the ability to hammer, either accidentally or otherwise. There should be a separate vote to end the day early, a brief majority shouldn't end everything.

The point of having it that way is that you can't change your mind after it happens. Once a majority is reached, it's set in stone to occur, and you can't change it. It adds another layer of needing to be sure of your opinions and your arguments.

ShadowsEdge · 2019-11-28 20:43:02

How come I'm always the one that's labelled as "game narrator." People do that sort of stuff all the time but I'm the only one who get's called out as a game narrator.

ShadowsEdge · 2019-11-28 20:46:43

I'm not mad, just hate the fact that I'm always pinned as Game Narrator despite all my efforts to try and not be a Game Narrator.

ShadowsEdge · 2019-11-30 03:44:19

NorwegianboyEE wrote:

Kirby literally had a list of the roles which would have been extremely helpful for town and he didn’t share it. And now he’s dead.

I assume Onjit had some sort of system in place that prevented Kirby from revealing all of that information. Not concrete, but Onjit doesn't want to share the setup with us directly, which means there's something to be hidden in it. For a role to just know the entire setup, and to be able to just willingly reveal all that information sort of defeats that purpose of having a closed setup.

Crybaby wrote:

because they would know who that person is and try to partner up with them for their own benefit

The Mafia knowing who the Hitman is wouldn't be a drastic fall for us. The Mafia wouldn't have any way to communicate with said Hitman other than in the public. If they choose to show their scumminess to the Hitman to show that they're the mafia in order to team up with them, then the Town can pick up on it. If they continue to act Towny, it'll likely just make them a target to the Hitman.

That's how I see it, unless there are special mechanics going on in this game that allow for the Mafia to do so in another way.

ShadowsEdge · 2019-11-30 08:49:18

Pqwerty wrote:

Also, can Peace explain why he thought we shouldn't trust ZeldaXD's mason claim, can ShadowsEdge please explain the distrust in NorwegianBoy and the claim that we can't communicate fully (criticized by Kira in #130), can Crybaby explain the thought process behind #157, and can Diff explain why he keeps saying he's scum?

Norwegian said for us to distrust him. I don't distrust Norwegian as being town, he's confirmed as town. My issue is in the fact that with confirmed town members, they have all the cards, they can essentially alter the entire consensus of the town, since no one has any reason to distrust them.

The reason for the distrust is to avoid that. Norwegian is a good player, and I do believe they'll do their best to lead us, but they're still a simple townie, they can be wrong, and if everyone follows them blindly, then it can lead to bad results sometimes.

I explained the reason why we can't "Communicate fully." It's just a matter of trust. Everyone has their own information, and not everyone will share everything, because any information they share here will have to be shared publicly, which means to the Mafia as well.

Kira's issue with me is that we were talking about different subtopics. Kira was referring more to general consensus, such as agreeing to not follow wagons blindly, while I was talking about general distrust through the town. While they do tie into the same topic, they're different in a sense, and what I was criticized for isn't for fault, but I was talking about something separate. Though, what Kira said isn't wrong.

NorwegianboyEE wrote:

I don’t think i’ve played with Pqwerty before, but the fact that he seems to make some really valid points and has a good tone for what i assume is his first game is... worrying.

That's true, but you never know if he's played any other Mafia-type games in other platforms.

ShadowsEdge · 2019-11-30 08:53:50

Last game I did commit fully to my reads. That's how I continued Mutant's Nomination Mafia flashbacks.

ShadowsEdge · 2019-11-30 17:01:12

May I ask, what specifically is the belief of Different55 being Patient Zero? I read through the thread and didn't really understand how it all turned to Different55 being Patient Zero.

Different55

ShadowsEdge · 2019-11-30 17:04:50

Can Patient Zero vote for anyone that voted for them throughout the day, or is it only people who vote for them at the end of the day?

ShadowsEdge · 2019-11-30 17:07:28

Kira wrote:

No one is willing to listen to me but allow me to post my thoughts first.
> I am hitman. My win condition has been met. Like I said previously, I will side with town. If you want to lynch me, then that's fine, I have nothing to lose/gain anymore.
> We gain much more lynching potential scums than a neutral that has no purpose whatsoever to the game anymore.
> Lynch an actual scum, and Crybaby can shoot me, I'm also fine with this. We have twilight time which would allow discussion.
I am no threat to town, so killing me is useless.

Kira these posts are exactly why people keep thinking you are scum. You keep saying "If you want to lynch me, that's fine," but then every few posts pop back in with the same reasoning, and reassurance that if we lynch you it'll be fine.

If you really are fine with being lynched, you wouldn't be repeating the same points over and over hoping that it makes people decide not to lynch you.

TaskManager

ShadowsEdge · 2019-11-30 17:15:03

peace wrote:

Kira wrote:
No one is willing to listen to me but allow me to post my thoughts first.
> I am hitman. My win condition has been met. Like I said previously, I will side with town. If you want to lynch me, then that's fine, I have nothing to lose/gain anymore.
> We gain much more lynching potential scums than a neutral that has no purpose whatsoever to the game anymore.
> Lynch an actual scum, and Crybaby can shoot me, I'm also fine with this. We have twilight time which would allow discussion.
I am no threat to town, so killing me is useless.
and diff??
alos its quite weird noneo countercliams kira to make him even more scum

Because depending on what Hitman is, if it's more like an NK, then CCing it would only make that person suspicious. Just because there's no CC's to Kira's claim doesn't mean anything.

ShadowsEdge · 2019-11-30 17:18:37

peace wrote:

what even is a framer role can someone epxlain me what a framer can do?

They frame someone as mafia. If a faction cop investigates that player the night they're framed, they'll show up as Mafia instead of their original alignment.

ShadowsEdge · 2019-11-30 17:37:15

What I find specifically odd about it is that Hitman, which Kira claims to be an Executioner type role, is one of the roles that's considered a "criminal," but Patient Zero, which seems like more of a threat to the town than the Hitman being an Executioner-type role, isn't considered a Criminal.

Slabdrill, mutantdevle

ShadowsEdge · 2019-11-30 19:11:55

mrjawapa wrote:

Why is everyone assuming mutant is telling the truth?
When has mutant ever done that?

Of course Mutant could be lying. But Mutant's assessment of Kira lead us to a Hitman claim. To me, Mutant's claim is just a cherry on top, because Kira keeps saying that they're fine with being lynched, repeatidly to the point where it just seems like a tactic to get us to unvote for them. On top of that, all we know about the Hitman, if Kira really is the Hitman, is from what Kira has told us, there could be parts of it that Kira is hiding to support their longevity.

I believe someone before said that lynching Kira was one of the ways to test Mutant's claim. And why do you assume that Mutant never tells the truth? If Mutant is town, they'd more likely than not be telling the truth, if they were mafia then it's a different story. But you just outright claim that they never tell the truth.

I'll vote for Kira later, iirc, Kira has 4 votes against him right now, with majority being 6.

ShadowsEdge · 2019-12-01 02:19:35

One thing I want to point out to you Pqwerty, I believe Patient Zero doesn't die if they don't infect anyone, I think that's only the infectees, unless I understood it wrong.

I plan on roleclaiming soon, I have information, but there's something I'm working out before I actually do so.

ShadowsEdge · 2019-12-01 02:34:35

Alright, so since I've already revealed I have information, I want to get it out now, in case I die tonight.

I'm the Roleblocker. I roleblocked Different55 N1, because I thought they were scummy because of how they changed their playstyle from last game to this one.

I clarified with Onjit, infecting players does count as a night action, and because I roleblocked Diff, it's highly unlikely that Diff is Patient Zero, unless there's some mechanic at play for Patient to be roleblock immune.

That's my bit, I don't think Different is Patient Zero, hence why I've been asking a bunch of questions about Different.

Slabdrill, Different55

ShadowsEdge · 2019-12-01 02:52:44

Mafia 36: The Roleclaim Game

ShadowsEdge · 2019-12-01 03:09:57

Pqwerty wrote:

mutantdevle wrote:
Pqwerty wrote:
Wouldn't patient 0 show up on Kirby's list of criminals though?
If there is one thing we are missing its this. This suggests that the infection isn't real which would point to peace and jawapa as being mafia. However, there are 3 reasons I don't buy into it over the current way of thinking about things. First of all, I simply don't think peace is capable of any of this as mafia. Secondly, it's ridiculously easy to prove as a lie. And finally, it would seem kinda unfair for Kirby to lose just because an infected person made it to end game when he has no role-related way of stopping it. So basically, I just think that the infection isn't considered as a criminal for the sake of Kirby's role's wincon.
@Shadow
Also, Slabdrill why did you investigate Mutant and how does claiming help the town? How is your role any different than a faction cop?
@Both Why did you both claim at once? Coincidence? What pressured you two to claim?

Yeah, I do agree that it could be a hoax. But like Mutant said, I'm not sure of Peace's capability in that aspect. But it is still definitely a possibility.

As for your second part, we both claimed that we would claim later on. I didn't claim before because I was still gathering my bearings, I was asking about the reasons for believing that Different is Patient Zero, and I was asking Onjit a question specifically about the mechanics of the role, which I did mention in that post. I waited until now because I was waiting for Onjit to respond to my question so that I had more accuracy.

The fact that me and Slabdrill roleclaimed at the same time is merely a coincidence, I cant say fully for why they claimed, but I assume it's because of the suspicion on them.

ShadowsEdge · 2019-12-01 03:30:25

Unsure, but if Patient Zero doesn't have roleblock immunity, then Different cannot be Patient Zero.

ShadowsEdge · 2019-12-01 19:51:05

mutantdevle wrote:

Are you confusing diff with Kira? I can see why you'd get mixed up. They are very similar names.

That's wrong and you know it. Of course I know who I roleblocked last night. I didn't roleblock Kira, I roleblocked Diff. My assumption is one of two things, either there's a second, Mafia, roleblocker. Or, there's a third party source causing the conundrum (I don't know what roles Onjit used, but from ToS, the only ones that would make sense would be Transporter and Witch). In this case, I did roleblock Diff, but the third party source affected it to move me to roleblock Kira. The Latter seems less likely with the amount of claims, so I think it's more likely that there's both a Town and Mafia roleblocker.

To pqwerty if there is a second roleblocker, they likely won't cc me. Because then it confirms the fact that there is both a Town and Mafia roleblocker, and knowing myself as the Town Roleblocker, they'll be confirmed as scum to me.

And to add onto it, almost everyone has claimed at this point, which means that the other possible Mafia Roleblocker would most likely have to change their claim to cc Roleblocker.

mutantdevle wrote:

Shadow's claim is false. Diff really is patient zero. peace was telling the truth so jawapa is town. Shadow, Slabdrill and pqwerty are the mafia team. Sanity is restored. GG. Let's end the day now.

My claim is not false. If you want to lynch me to find that out, go ahead. I never said Diff can't be Patient Zero, I said I don't believe they're Patient Zero, because I roleblocked Diff on account of my suspicion against him D1. The only way that Diff can be Patient Zero is if the latter of the two options (mentioned at the start of the post) is true, or if Patient Zero has roleblock immunity.

Peace and Jawapa are still not confirmed. You're assuming all of this based on a situation that isn't true. I'm not mafia, and again, if you want to find that out then lynch me.

The presence of the infection isn't exactly confirmed either. The only accounts of it are from Peace and Jawapa, furthering that connection.

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#1 2019-11-26 13:25:29, last edited by Onjit (2019-12-10 10:19:40)