The Data Security Breach - Please Update Your Passwords

Xenonetix · 2019-03-30 16:08:00

mutantdevle wrote:

Albeit not directly to you and instead more baiting the community into the drama, he does ask for evidence of his guilt in this thread: https://forums.everybodyedits.com/viewt … p?id=45573

The only question asked in that post:

thegame wrote:

If the owner has no evidence, then I should deserve the same treatment that he gives the rest of the community correct?

Correct. Good thing I have the evidence. I do indeed have no intent on sharing the evidence, primarily because it benefits no one for us to share the details of our investigations, and would just cause more drama and controversy. The caveat given in his one question is "If the owner has no evidence,". By the very fact that the owner has some evidence, the rest of his point becomes moot.

I never announced thegame's involvement in the whole situation. More than one individual was involved, and I have spoken to some of the other people involved as well, none of whom have come forward or spread further drama. In the Patreon Discord, I posted last Thursday following the question of who was behind the attacks: "I know who leaked the information - I do not believe it benefits anyone to reveal that information".

If he wishes to discuss it with me further, he is free to do so. He has me on Discord, and never denied or disputed any of the accusations made. As far as I am concerned, the overall case is closed.

mutantdevle, Tomahawk, Kirby, Minimania

peace · 2019-03-30 16:10:41

Xenonetix wrote:

mutantdevle wrote:
Albeit not directly to you and instead more baiting the community into the drama, he does ask for evidence of his guilt in this thread: https://forums.everybodyedits.com/viewt … p?id=45573
The only question asked in that post:
thegame wrote:
If the owner has no evidence, then I should deserve the same treatment that he gives the rest of the community correct?
Correct. Good thing I have the evidence. I do indeed have no intent on sharing the evidence, primarily because it benefits no one for us to share the details of our investigations, and would just cause more drama and controversy. The caveat given in his one question is "If the owner has no evidence,". By the very fact that the owner has some evidence, the rest of his point becomes moot.

maby if you share the edivence to him he becoems quiet but it stil weird that you completely delete an acoutn instea dof banning it

Xenonetix · 2019-03-30 16:17:36

peace wrote:

maby if you share the edivence to him he becoems quiet

I doubt it in his case. Whether he was involved or not, he would just choose to share the evidence to generate further drama, and continue to deny his involvement.

peace wrote:

but it stil weird that you completely delete an acoutn instea dof banning it

Not really. Providing our accusations are true, the people involved are directly responsible for the deletion of over 180 accounts. It's only because LukeM happened to have backups from a couple of days prior that we were able to restore them, and that still took us many hours/days to do. As such, I felt it only fair that the punishment for deleting 180 accounts should be to delete their own main accounts.

XxAtillaxX · 2019-03-30 17:04:17

Xenonetix wrote:

mutantdevle wrote:
Albeit not directly to you and instead more baiting the community into the drama, he does ask for evidence of his guilt in this thread: https://forums.everybodyedits.com/viewt … p?id=45573
The only question asked in that post:
thegame wrote:
If the owner has no evidence, then I should deserve the same treatment that he gives the rest of the community correct?
Correct. Good thing I have the evidence. I do indeed have no intent on sharing the evidence, primarily because it benefits no one for us to share the details of our investigations, and would just cause more drama and controversy. The caveat given in his one question is "If the owner has no evidence,". By the very fact that the owner has some evidence, the rest of his point becomes moot.
I never announced thegame's involvement in the whole situation. More than one individual was involved, and I have spoken to some of the other people involved as well, none of whom have come forward or spread further drama. In the Patreon Discord, I posted last Thursday following the question of who was behind the attacks: "I know who leaked the information - I do not believe it benefits anyone to reveal that information".
If he wishes to discuss it with me further, he is free to do so. He has me on Discord, and never denied or disputed any of the accusations made. As far as I am concerned, the overall case is closed.

You should provide an explanation to TheGame, he deserves to know the details surrounding his punishment, and if he feels like it should be public information he deserves to have EVERY right to share it with whomever he pleases.
You are really making yourself seem like a know-it-all that can't ever be wrong about any of the actions you take. Do you really want to go down this route of being a tyrant?

Xenonetix wrote:

I doubt it in his case. Whether he was involved or not, he would just choose to share the evidence to generate further drama, and continue to deny his involvement.

What a WONDERFUL excuse for not giving an explanation as to why they were punished. You are really outdoing yourself.

Zumza

Xenonetix · 2019-03-30 17:27:30

XxAtillaxX wrote:

You should provide an explanation to TheGame, he deserves to know the details surrounding his punishment, and if he feels like it should be public information he deserves to have EVERY right to share it with whomever he pleases.

Agreed, hence:

Xenonetix wrote:

If he wishes to discuss it with me further, he is free to do so. He has me on Discord, and never denied or disputed any of the accusations made.

Quite frankly, it's none of anyone else's business, and it's certainly not yours. TheGame decided to tell you our conversation, and that was his decision to make. You decided to share the conversation you had with TheGame in the unofficial Discord, and yet I don't see any evidence that TheGame allowed you to make the conversation you had with him public either. Once again, you have taken the matter into your own hands, when it is literally of no business to you, and appears only to be for light entertainment for you. It is a private matter, and I was fully ready to answer any further questions TheGame had for me in that conversation, but as you've seen for yourself, the only questions he asked were "would you like to call me bob or elonmusk69", and "How is EEU". I have never blocked him, and he is completely free to ask me further questions if he has them, but I do not believe it is anyone else's business in the community at all to demand explanations from me, because they would get us nowhere to do so.

XxAtillaxX wrote:

You are really making yourself seem like a know-it-all that can't ever be wrong about any of the actions you take. Do you really want to go down this route of being a tyrant?

Never asserted to being wrong or right. The evidence we currently have points to the people involved being responsible, so we have taken the appropriate action on the people responsible. It's not tyrannical to investigate a serious situation, and then act on it.

So quickly we forget that, thoughout all of this, I never once believed you (Atilla) had anything to do with it, and yet the number of people claiming it was so obviously you, and that I should be confronting you, was overwhelming, including the person you appear to be trying to defend so vehemently, who instantly tried to pass the blame on to you. We investigated properly, and came to the conclusion you were not involved. If we had just listened to the community, we would have had to take action on you far sooner, and as a result of the investigations, we have taken no action on you at all. Are those truly the actions of a tyrant?

LukeM, mutantdevle, mrjawapa

XxAtillaxX · 2019-03-30 17:42:12

Xenonetix wrote:

Never asserted to being wrong or right. The evidence we currently have points to the people involved being responsible, so we have taken the appropriate action on the people responsible. It's not tyrannical to investigate a serious situation, and then act on it.
So quickly we forget that, thoughout all of this, I never once believed you (Atilla) had anything to do with it, and yet the number of people claiming it was so obviously you, and that I should be confronting you, was overwhelming, including the person you appear to be trying to defend so vehemently, who instantly tried to pass the blame on to you. We investigated properly, and came to the conclusion you were not involved. If we had just listened to the community, we would have had to take action on you far sooner, and as a result of the investigations, we have taken no action on you at all. Are those truly the actions of a tyrant?

You are fully capable of providing an explanation to those who you punished, and that is absolutely the mature and responsible thing to do.
It is tyrannical to punish someone and proceed to deny them the evidence demonstrating their involvement in a crime, as most judges do.

I don't have any involvement and I'm free to defend the falsely accused, especially those who are denied evidence. I simply don't care how many people speculate upon any specific individual. I believe in evidence-based reasoning and I believe you purport to as well.

I repeat on behalf of many others and ask why won't you provide him with the evidence. You are inadvertently inspiring more drama by denying him the evidence for his punishment than there would be from evidence demonstrating that he is at fault.

If you have overwhelming evidence, then why do you feel the need to hide it? It appears like you're afraid that perhaps your investigations went flat and you hastily found someone to scapegoat, perhaps to fulfill your own satisfaction of receiving justice, even when your actions are really an injustice and lack the evidence to actually convict him of anything. I ask again, why are you afraid to share the evidence?

Xenonetix wrote:

Quite frankly, it's none of anyone else's business, and it's certainly not yours. TheGame decided to tell you our conversation, and that was his decision to make. You decided to share the conversation you had with TheGame in the unofficial Discord, and yet I don't see any evidence that TheGame allowed you to make the conversation you had with him public either. Once again, you have taken the matter into your own hands, when it is literally of no business to you, and appears only to be for light entertainment for you. It is a private matter, and I was fully ready to answer any further questions TheGame had for me in that conversation, but as you've seen for yourself, the only questions he asked were "would you like to call me bob or elonmusk69", and "How is EEU". I have never blocked him, and he is completely free to ask me further questions if he has them, but I do not believe it is anyone else's business in the community at all to demand explanations from me, because they would get us nowhere to do so.

No, it isn't just merely entertainment for me. I'm serious, if you couldn't tell.

I haven't taken matters into my own hands, I am asking you simple questions, like you've asked me.
He literally made a topic asking why you deleted his account. I don't know whether you're acting blind or disingenuous, or both.

It won't get anyone anywhere by accepting that your conclusions are always right because you're the owner and whatever you say goes.

EDIT: I had to edit my post because Xeno silently edited his reply towards me.

Kikikan, Zumza

Xenonetix · 2019-03-30 18:04:41

XxAtillaxX wrote:

You are fully capable of providing an explanation to those who you punished, and that is absolutely the mature and responsible thing to do.

And have communicated with those who I could get in contact with. I have answered every question they've asked me.

XxAtillaxX wrote:

It is tyrannical to punish someone and proceed to deny them the evidence demonstrating their involvement in a crime, as most judges do.

You consider judges as tyrants? I think that probably says more about your view of the world than anything else, but anyway, I have not denied anyone involved the evidence. TheGame has not asked for any evidence, nor asked me any follow-up questions following the accusations. As far as I can tell, he has accepted his punishment, and is now just generally producing drama for further entertainment.

I have denied the community the evidence. The community does not need to know the details of the investigation.

XxAtillaxX wrote:

I believe in evidence-based reasoning and I believe you purport to as well.

Indeed. You know me well enough to believe I definitely do have evidence, and such an accusation on TheGame is not unfounded.

XxAtillaxX wrote:

I repeat on behalf of many others and ask why won't you provide him with the evidence. You are inadvertently inspiring more drama by denying him the evidence for his punishment than there would be from evidence demonstrating that he is at fault.

You can repeat it as many times as you like. The reason is because he has not asked for the evidence, and that is it. It is no one else's place in the community, not even yours, to ask on his behalf. You may believe this is somehow inspiring more drama, but I believe the dramatic fallback from revealing a list of everyone who was involved, and the full evidence behind how they were involved, would create drama of epic proportions, providing far more damage to the game in the long-run, if such drama were ever to end.

XxAtillaxX wrote:

If you have overwhelming evidence, then why do you feel the need to hide it?

Haven't hidden it from anyone involved. TheGame can make the claim that I'm hiding it from him all he likes, but absolutely nothing in my conversation with him led me to believe he wasn't rightly accused, and he acted as if he knew it all already anyway. My belief is that he hasn't asked for evidence because he's fully aware of his involvement, and the evidence would simply be providing information he already knows.

Again, I feel the need to hide it from the community, because the community does not need to know.

EDIT: I think I silently edited a spelling mistake, but whatever.

Minimania

XxAtillaxX · 2019-03-30 18:14:42

Xenonetix wrote:

You consider judges as tyrants? I think that probably says more about your view of the world than anything else, but anyway, I have not denied anyone involved the evidence. TheGame has not asked for any evidence, nor asked me any follow-up questions following the accusations. As far as I can tell, he has accepted his punishment, and is now just generally producing drama for further entertainment.
I have denied the community the evidence. The community does not need to know the details of the investigation.

I don't. I was saying the opposite, obviously judges detail the evidence and provide testimonies before those who are convicted.
You are doing the opposite, you are denying him the evidence for why he is guilty.

"You can repeat it as many times as you like. The reason is because he has not asked for the evidence, and that is it. It is no one else's place in the community, not even yours, to ask on his behalf. You may believe this is somehow inspiring more drama, but I believe the dramatic fallback from revealing a list of everyone who was involved, and the full evidence behind how they were involved, would create drama of epic proportions, providing far more damage to the game in the long-run, if such drama were ever to end."

TheGame asked for the evidence on his forum topic.

Zumza, Luka504

Xenonetix · 2019-03-30 18:27:44

Welp, now I've really screwed up, having accidentally edited your post instead of creating a new one. Can't wait for the drama surrounding that.

XxAtillaxX wrote:

TheGame asked for the evidence on his forum topic.

Great. We've reached an impasse then, because if he doesn't communicate with me directly, we're not going to get anywhere. As far as I can tell, the only reason to post such a thread is to produce drama, because he could have just asked me directly, and I'd have provided whatever information he'd like to hear in regards to the events.

St1ckS4m(EE)

frostflare · 2019-03-30 18:41:25

Xenonetix wrote:

Welp, now I've really screwed up, having accidentally edited your post instead of creating a new one. Can't wait for the drama surrounding that.

BAD XENO! NO COOKIE FOR YOU!

Xenonetix, Minimania, Fateskr

TaskManager · 2019-03-30 18:53:21

XxAtillaxX wrote:

XxAtillaxX wrote:
TheGame asked for the evidence on his forum topic.
Great. We've reached an impasse then, because if he doesn't communicate with me directly, we're not going to get anywhere. As far as I can tell, the only reason to post such a thread is to produce drama, because he could have just asked me directly, and I'd have provided whatever information he'd like to hear in regards to the events.
Last edited by Xenonetix (Today 19:26:43)

Xenonetix wrote:

Welp, now I've really screwed up, having accidentally edited your post instead of creating a new one. Can't wait for the drama surrounding that.

editing someone's post just to tease them while you have no valid right or reason to do so
great work xeno! professionalism checks out once again!

Zumza

Different55 · 2019-03-30 19:07:55

Rolled back post, inserted the edited text into Xeno's post.

Xenonetix, Minimania

XxAtillaxX · 2019-03-30 19:14:06

Xenonetix wrote:

Great. We've reached an impasse then, because if he doesn't communicate with me directly, we're not going to get anywhere. As far as I can tell, the only reason to post such a thread is to produce drama, because he could have just asked me directly, and I'd have provided whatever information he'd like to hear in regards to the events.

I reckon because he probably believes other people deserve to know when someone was personally attacked by an administrator and had their account deleted on the basis of **** evidence or a lack of evidence full stop.

Why does everyone have to approach you directly in order to receive a response?
You are fully capable of contacting him right now if you wanted to and provide the evidence you claim you have.

Zumza

peace · 2019-03-30 20:11:06

i think we coudl leaeve this alogn now an djust wokr on EEU/EEupdates and just makesur enothign ahppens again look it fomr the bright side he is not perma banned or ip banned he can make a new acc if he wishes to

mutantdevle · 2019-03-30 23:01:52

Atilla, I don't get why you repeatedly accused Xeno of holding back evidence multiple times when Xeno has literally stated in every post on this page so far that that isn't what he is doing at all.

I fully understand why Xeno won't tell thegame what evidence he has unless he directly asks for it. The thread he made was clearly not made with the intent of getting an answer from Xeno and instead it's sole purpose was to create more drama. I don't intend for this to sound like "thegame must be guilty!" but if he did genuinely care about being proven innocent then he would most certainly be private messaging Xeno over the matter alongside creating the thread. I don't think that Xeno is obligated to make the first move and offer all the information to him regardless. If nothing else that'd be a waste of time and effort. It's kinda like a parking fine. You get sent the fine and you can either accept it or ask for the evidence. There's a chance you can appeal the fine if you prove the evidence is not sufficient, but you certainly can't ask for information on someone else's fine.

LukeM, Xenonetix, frostflare

XxAtillaxX · 2019-03-30 23:54:06

He did hold back evidence, it isn't a baseless accusation. He stated that he has evidence, and he didn't present it to TheGame before taking the administrative action of deleting his account.

Now, after he was proven wrong about TheGame being responsible, he ordered Luke to restore the account. He didn't have to provide any evidence, but he most certainly should have, as those who are punished deserve to know the reason why they were.

It's very common in any judicial process.
As I've previously stated, it may very well be the case that TheGame feels like the community deserves to know about the actions the owner is taking without having legitimate evidence, as is further proven by Xeno restoring his account - yet apparently his ego is too fragile to admit he was wrong publicly.

With a parking fine, there is direct evidence that they exceeded the duration of the parking limits or illegally parked. A **** comparison. You can appeal in court because that's a civil right for citizens.

mutantdevle · 2019-03-31 00:52:39

XxAtillaxX wrote:

He stated that he has evidence, and he didn't present it to TheGame before taking the administrative action of deleting his account.

You don't present the evidence before you take action, you present the evidence afterwards. He has stated on so many occasions that he's been willing to supply said evidence so long as he is asked directly. That's not withholding evidence in any way.

XxAtillaxX wrote:

He didn't have to provide any evidence, but he most certainly should have, as those who are punished deserve to know the reason why they were.

He knew the reason he was punished... because Xeno believed he was responsible for the hacking. The evidence comes later when properly requested as Xeno stated several times.

I assume the reason that Thegame has had his account restored is that he was provided with the evidence against him and was then able to disprove it? If so, is there any valid reason why thegame's initial response wasn't to try and prove his innocence and instead chose to bait Xeno and stir up drama on the forums?

frostflare

XxAtillaxX · 2019-03-31 02:05:15

You don't need to be so desperate to defend his behaviour.
You present evidence before you punish them so that they can refute it, especially when the evidence you presumably have is flawed. As it was, since his account was restored.

The only reason for when someone's account should be deleted before presenting evidence is when their access to their account presents further opportunity to attack.

As was previously pointed out by Yonom, the termination of his account does absolutely nothing to prevent any further attacks from occurring. If anything, it stirs the pot, especially with his unnecessary personal insults. Very unprofessional behaviour.

Zumza

Processor · 2019-03-31 03:37:11

@Xenonetix:
Deleting an account before approaching the person is uncooperative behavior.
It shouldn't surprise you that Thegame will be uncooperative in response to that.
Human psychology is to be blamed.

@Atilla:
I've pointed out that deleting accounts is unprofessional.
Maybe Xeno agrees. That could be why Thegame's account was restored.
Maybe Thegame is still believed to be the hacker. Maybe not.

@Everyone:
I am not a fan of public shaming.
The community does not need to know who the hackers are.
The staff does not need to know who the hackers are.

The longer they drag this out, the longer they will procrastinate from the real issues. Namely:
- making the game more secure
- faster communication when things go wrong
- increased transparency

Let's get back to business

drstereos, mutantdevle, skullz17, Introduction

Minimania · 2019-03-31 04:14:22

Processor wrote:

@Xenonetix:
Deleting an account before approaching the person is uncooperative behavior.
It shouldn't surprise you that Thegame will be uncooperative in response to that.
Human psychology is to be blamed.
@Atilla:
I've pointed out that deleting accounts is unprofessional.
Maybe Xeno agrees. That could be why Thegame's account was restored.
Maybe Thegame is still believed to be the hacker. Maybe not.
@Everyone:
I am not a fan of public shaming.
The community does not need to know who the hackers are.
The staff does not need to know who the hackers are.
The longer they drag this out, the longer they will procrastinate from the real issues. Namely:
- making the game more secure
- faster communication when things go wrong
- increased transparency
Let's get back to business

Poetry right here, ladies and gentlemen.

Anatoly · 2019-03-31 06:31:09

Processor wrote:

@Everyone:
I am not a fan of public shaming.
The community does not need to know who the hackers are.
The staff does not need to know who the hackers are.

thegame himself started the topic, zeno was silent at this point

mutantdevle

Zumza · 2019-03-31 10:18:07

Personally I do not understand why Xeno would prefer conceal the evidence, prolonging the drama regarding his actions, and injuring his own image by doing so.

In the very short leak of chat we had, Xeno gives the impression that he barely knows what he is speaking about: Deletes TheGame acc., then accuses them of self-removing themselves from the leaked csv list(which proved to be a false accusation), to then proceed restoring his account.

This event seems to pile up on the long list of times Xeno's judgment was clouded by his rage, and only because of the voice of the community the reasonable choices are made.

Xeno is losing his credibility each time he undermines the community.

Luka504, coinage, Thegame, Fateskr

Luka504 · 2019-03-31 11:14:42

I completely agree. Everything that has happened up until this point only further cements my belief that Xeno isn't someone I should treat seriously at all.

If Thegame's account is being restored, then that's pretty good indication that either there was no evidence suggesting he was guilty, or the evidence was very flimsy and weak.

This isn't the first time Xeno has done something like this, and the more he keeps doing it, the less likely people are to trust any accusations he may make in the future.

TaskManager, coinage, Zumza

Anatoly · 2019-03-31 12:32:07

Luka504 wrote:

I completely agree. Everything that has happened up until this point only further cements my belief that Xeno isn't someone I should treat seriously at all.
If Thegame's account is being restored, then that's pretty good indication that either there was no evidence suggesting he was guilty, or the evidence was very flimsy and weak.
This isn't the first time Xeno has done something like this, and the more he keeps doing it, the less likely people are to trust any accusations he may make in the future.

The difference between old and young people is that young people do not admit their mistakes, when the old do. Xeno clearly showed that he is still to young to own EE. But from what I've seen he won't give the ownership away. This is the end of EE.

mutantdevle · 2019-03-31 13:42:57

XxAtillaxX wrote:

You don't need to be so desperate to defend his behaviour.

I'm not defending specifically his behaviour. The only defence I'm making is that Xeno receives so much **** for every mistake he makes, no matter how big or small, and it's constantly being heavily exaggerated how unreasonable his behaviour is. Whilst I wouldn't have done the same things that Xeno has done if I was in his position, in my opinion, the only harmful mistake he has made here is the words he used to criticise thegame regardless of his guilt.

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#51 2019-03-30 16:08:00, last edited by Xenonetix (2019-03-30 16:14:14)

Re: The Data Security Breach - Please Update Your Passwords

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