Official Everybody Edits Forums

XxAtillaxX

Member

Joined: 2015-11-28

Posts: 4,202

Re: I am thankful

I don't recall any instance of you telling me to speak to NVD, who was not on at any point within the 22 hours (approximately) between you removing my privileges, and my resignation. You removed them before I went to work, and then I woke up the following day just before I went to work to find none of the staff has reinstated them, so I don't know why you seem to believe they would have been restored within a day when they weren't.

Trigger, as it contains cursing.

▼CONTENT WARNING

...in your 'professional' opinion. It would have been up to NVD whether to "fire" me. You still had no right to make that decision on his behalf. Also, "other harm" in what sense? What harm was I doing to anyone but yourself? Even that wasn't harmful to you, as you well know, so I wasn't doing harm to anyone at all.

I didn't make that decision on his behalf. I temporarily revoked your moderator privileges as to prevent you from lashing out on anyone else, and/or causing damage. You already acted way out of line towards me, why would you be trusted to act reasonably to anyone else?

I don't know why you keep cycling back around to this weak counterpoint. If you hadn't have removed the privileges, I wouldn't have taken any further moderator actions related to the situation, and I wouldn't have left. I said before I went to bed that: "If I haven't had my modship reinstated by the time I wake up, I will have no choice but to quit." How was I supposed to do anything in this voluntary 'job' if I had no tools to do it? It was a 9 hour period in which any one of you, Jesse, or Showpath could have reinstated my modship, and chose not to.

I don't trust your claims, you've already directed stated towards NVD in private messages you've specified that, and I quote, "I'm not Kira - I'm not going to take out my staff frustrations on the community" - you did exactly that, you took out your frustrations on me and banned my community account.

You didn't have "no choice" you had every ability to wait until NVD came online, which he did shortly after you had resigned.

If any reasonable person would have acted the same way removing powers from within Everybody Edits over an incident that occurred outside of Everybody Edits (in Slack in this case), then any reasonable person would also have taken the action to punish someone within Everybody Edits over an incident that occurred outside of Everybody Edits (in Slack in this case).

That doesn't make any sense whatsoever. You banned my community account for 99+ days, that's directly in-game related not 'outside of Everybody Edits'.

If it isn't your decision (or 'right') to reinstate them, then it couldn't have been your rightful decision to have removed them in the first place.

I took the decision to temporarily remove your moderator privileges, and told you to speak to Niels. If you had done so, the situation would have been sorted internally rather than you taking a tantrum, departing and then crying about how I wronged you, when in fact you directly attacked me.

You say this as if it's a bad thing. Thousands of online communities have official forums that are directly linked to actions on both the forums and in their games. People are regularly banned in the games and the forums at the same time for the same period of time. The Everybody Edits community is an anomaly from a forum-to-game connection point of view.

It is a bad thing. I don't want the in-game moderators controlling and dictating my speech, nor vice versa.
I highly value the non-state-sponsored, independent commentary and opinions as well as the opportunity to have a community platform divested from the control of in-game moderators and administrators.

I think it'd be fair to state that most people on the forums don't want to be banned in-game for something they said or a rule they broke on the forums, or on the Discord server. I think they'd much prefer having them as separate entities. In this way, it's very similar to freedom of the press.

I agree that, if Phina wished to do so, she had every right to ban me, but having my mod abilities taken away makes no sense. I would not have circumvented the ban if I were banned.

I think it does make sense to temporarily remove moderation privileges from a moderator who is abusing those very privileges.
I don't truly believe that you wouldn't have, pure hypothetical. It's not unreasonable to address the situation rather than resign out of spite.

Calling me the N-word was called for? Sounds like an incredibly spiteful and uncalled for action to me to have called me it. As such, I would like to remove your developer privileges, because you went out of your way to do things incredibly spiteful and uncalled for.

The very nature of "abusing your power" is having it to abuse. You have far more power than I do, and they say "With great power comes great responsibility", and yet your actions have been immensely irresponsible, including your behaviour towards other members of the community in-game and on the forums.

You took in-game moderation action out of frustration towards me, and have been incredibly disrespectful towards your fellow staff members as well.
In this instance you're assuming that it is uncalled for, when Niels had stated previously that he understood why precautionary action was taken.

For all I know, you're simply a misunderstood individual, but the way you have come across on these forums for years has been as a villainous figure, who simply hacks things to get what they want (because they can) when they disagree with someone else's opinion or point of view. You're a very opinionated person who doesn't like being told they're wrong, and rarely seeks feedback. When you do seek feedback, you seem to do it for approval you were right rather than genuinely asking for help to improve on something. You are seemingly oblivious of your own power, as you do things most people don't have the ability to do without a moment's thought, as an instant reaction to something that happens, because you believe it to be the right thing to do in your mind, and try to justify it later on. If people disagree with your justification, you take the shortcut of setting out to punish the people who disagree with you instead of discussing the issues with an open mind as adults should do.

I haven't hacked anyone for having a differing point of view or opinion, citation highly needed. I am opinionated and so are you, and most of us.
I don't mind being corrected, and I do ask for feedback, help and suggestions.
I've shared and discussed my ideas within the team, and have received negative feedback. I've disposed many of them, and improved upon several others.

I justify my actions. You haven't justified why you had decided to issue a 99 day ban on my community account for a comment outside the game.
You said prior to doing so, "You don't like EE drama, and yet you insist on inciting it. So let's see how you feel about this".
You took that action without consulting Phinarose or any of the other staff prior, just like how you banned Thegame and Ogotu.

You didn't seek feedback, and you tried to justify it after the fact by stating that you think it's "100% related to EE" and when corrected by Jesse, you merely responded "Ok then".

I haven't punished anyone for disagreeing with me. You have, however.

To simplify this a little, although I know you don't need it simplified - Before you were given developer powers: Let's say a user called '69AtillaSucks69' is roaming Everybody Edits spamming "Atilla Sucks" everywhere (or, obviously, much worse). Any regular community member would "Report Abuse" as an inappropriate username or for spamming, and a moderator would probably ban the account. If a moderator were to see it, they would ban them anyway. If you see it, I feel like you're far more likely to hack their account, find out their IP address, find out alternative accounts they have, track down email accounts, hack into their email accounts, delete many of their emails, possibly send a bunch of inappropriate emails out for a laugh, and if they'd really **** you off, you'd find a way to hack into their bank accounts and steal money from them anonymously, but probably not given to yourself, but by spending it on something lavish that ends up being delivered to an offshore island somewhere for you to pick up in 7 years' time.

No, there have been people that have done exactly that and I didn't do anything against them nor would I.
I wouldn't damage their property or steal money from anyone either, what's with the ludicrous hypotheticals and defamation?

That is the sort of person you come across as, whether you intend for you to be that sort of person or not. Kids and teens are terrified of you as an individual, and don't want to stand up to you as a result. If they say one negative thing towards you, they're worried you will somehow ruin their life forever, because it would be so simple for you to do so. You have the power of intimidation that no one else in this community, staff or otherwise, has, and your actions against me are just further proof that you can do such things within seconds because you believe that's the best way to deal with something in the immediate short-term. As such, you come across as a dictator.

If you said to NVD, "if you don't start paying me such-and-such an amount on a weekly basis, I'll DDoS the game, and prevent all players from purchasing any more gems," I believe NVD would do it, because he wouldn't have any way to stop you. If you suddenly have a disagreement with NVD one day, I dread to think what the consequences would be on the game as a whole, and there would be no one who could stop you.

If they're terrified of me it's almost certainly because they hear absurd rhetoric from people like yourself that I'm 'far more likely to steal their money and deliver it to an offshore island' and the like.

The people that know me personally aren't intimidated by me, or at least they certainly don't act like it.
I have many friends who trust me, and I wouldn't want to instantly lose their respect and ruin friendships over that.
I've had disagreements with MrShoe and Nou, and I've also had disagreements with Niels. I haven't damaged the game as a result.

It's incorrect to state that there'd be no one who could stop me.

You underestimate the ability of law enforcement. I don't have strict anonymity on my Atilla Lonny alias, it'd be a trivial exercise to track me down for any criminal activity. I have signed documents with the United States DHS including my alias. In addition, there are a few people who have my full name including Phinarose. I don't think she'd be fine with me (nor anyone) blackmailing Niels, and rightfully so.

That was your interpretation, but if you claim to be so rational yourself, your mind wouldn't immediately go to the idea of "retaliation". Such things are to be discussed, and it wasn't a threat, so much as a veiled attempt to show there are consequences to your actions. You make so many staff decisions yourself that you claim don't concern you. Well, if they don't concern you, quite frankly, shut up and stop interfering then.

Would you like to know why I banned you? I did it to prove my point. The point was that, no matter what action were taken against you for your actions, you would use your power to instantly reverse and/or negate it because you disagreed with it. If anything, you then took that point a step further by not only using that power, but abusing it as well.

I'm not concerned with why you banned me. You can claim that your actions were to prove any point you like, but it doesn't matter - it was wrong.
I didn't abuse any power by attempting to prevent you from lashing out upon anyone else, including myself. In which instance(s) am I interfering?

You also admitted earlier that you were the one to demod Kira, and without discussion until after you did so, so I'm not sure how you expect this to be a reasonable argument on your side, because I agree with you. The staff should make the decision as a whole, not you.

I didn't demod Kira, nor did I admit to doing so. Citation needed. It was discussed amongst the staff, and I don't know who was the one to remove his moderator privileges. I assume it was Niels.

So you should have waited until he was online, and consulted with him, as he asked you to do. You're fully aware there was nothing I could do as a moderator, no matter how terrible, that you couldn't have reversed yourself, including clearing worlds and saving them (which I would never have done anyway however irrational I seemed), because of your World Backup, so it was in no way a 'pressing matter' where you HAD to remove my privileges there and then.

I can't be expected to catch every single revision of every world - nor would I find it acceptable to allow you to do so regardless. It'd be an incredibly painsteaking effort that could have been easily prevented by temporarily revoking moderator privileges until you spoke to Niels.

You should have waited until he was online, and consulted with him. He didn't ask me to do anything like that. In the screenshot, he said he'll pass it on to me - yet he never did.

This then appeared to be misconstrued by Atilla as an "unreasonable ban reason", when I was completely unaware that TheGame had not seen the original message in the first place. Atilla's reaction to this was to suggest I was abusing my power, and, rather than discussing it with the person who made the ban rationally, he took it upon himself to reverse the ban.

As I have stated, and Phinarose has confirmed this in her post if you'd care to read it, I didn't take it upon my myself to reverse the ban - I asked Phinarose beforehand, and she agreed. In addition, you were offline for an unreasonably long period of time, and only momentarily came online to re-issue the ban. I was unable to discuss it with you, otherwise I certainly would have.

So why the hell did they contact you of all people? Why would you have known what it meant? You said yourself you don't get involved in matters of moderation, so why the crapballs would the rest of the staff go to you instead of wait for me to come online to explain? Once again, it wasn't a pressing matter that had to be dealt with there and then, so why did you take action based on your own assumptions of what had happened?

By 'they' I am referring to Thegame and Ogotu. I told them that I don't know and I'll ask Phinarose, which I did.

You're not a fellow moderator. Other moderators do not have the ability to reverse other moderators' actions, exactly for the reason that they're supposed to be discussed with the moderators who made the action. If you had discussed it with me, it could have been cleared up.

You keep saying no one had the knowledge that I planned to ban TheGame, and yet the screenshot in Minimania's original post shows that I said exactly that, and I said it to everyone. Please stop accusing me of not talking to anyone about it when I actively tried to talk to people about it, and everyone ignored me. Stop putting me in your shoes as someone who has regularly taken actions without discussing them, when I keep trying not to take any action without discussing it AT LENGTH first.

I didn't say I was a "fellow moderator" - I am explicitly referring to Phinarose, benje00 and lrussell. My lord.
You didn't say anything about banning Thegame for 40 days and Ogotu for 3. You merely stated that you think they should be banned.

You didn't discuss it at length prior to taking any action in this instance.

I find it funny how you state "I keep trying not to take any action without discussing it AT LENGTH first"

Why is it then that you banned my community account for 99 days without discussing it with any other moderator or administrator.
Why is it that you banned Thegame for 40 days without discussing how specifically long the ban duration should be?
Why is it that you discussed with Ernesdo and insisted upon him doing work on behalf of Everybody Edits, without taking it up with any of us?

Exactly. You didn't. That wasn't particularly clear of you, was it? Y'know, considering you are an' all.

Except I'm not. I haven't been recognized in any way offically, and upon agreeing to help with development I made it clear that I didn't want to be.

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*u stinky*

Different55

Forum Admin

Joined: 2015-02-07

Posts: 16,574

Re: I am thankful

I didn't make that decision on his behalf. I temporarily revoked your moderator privileges as to prevent you from lashing out on anyone else, and/or causing damage. You already acted way out of line towards me, why would you be trusted to act reasonably to anyone else?

Bit confused here, it's not your place to handle moderators. When Proc was still around on the forums, I wouldn't expect him to start removing mods in this situation. Unless he's actively going on a rampage with no one else online I don't know why you'd step in.

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"Sometimes failing a leap of faith is better than inching forward"
- ShinsukeIto

XxAtillaxX

Member

Joined: 2015-11-28

Posts: 4,202

Re: I am thankful

Bit confused here, it's not your place to handle moderators. When Proc was still around on the forums, I wouldn't expect him to start removing mods in this situation. Unless he's actively going on a rampage with no one else online I don't know why you'd step in.

It's not my job, nor any other developers or moderators, to handle staff members. It's entirely Niels's duty to do so, and I wouldn't have done anything if he were there to deal with him appropriately - which he wasn't.
I don't know how you administrate your forums, but whereas you have mechanisms to preserve user-created content through backup exports, Everybody Edits unfortunately doesn't have a sufficient means of being able to do so, effectively.

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*u stinky*

Different55

Forum Admin

Joined: 2015-02-07

Posts: 16,574

Re: I am thankful

Ah fair point. Didn't realize EE didn't have any backups, that's actually a bit concerning.

Still though I don't think there was any reason to think Mega Lamb was about to go on any kind of rampage. No reason it couldn't have waited around for NVD.

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"Sometimes failing a leap of faith is better than inching forward"
- ShinsukeIto

XxAtillaxX

Member

Joined: 2015-11-28

Posts: 4,202

Re: I am thankful

Ah fair point. Didn't realize EE didn't have any backups, that's actually a bit concerning.

It has the bare minimum of export functionality, although it takes several hours to curate entirely, and on top of that there's no means for importing.

The format that they export in is a special form of JSON which has it's own **** up qualities, of which most likely explain why there's no import functionality.
In short, the way that they serialize byte arrays is through storing them as base-64 without any quotation marks. I had to write a special JSON deserializer to handle this.
In addition, they also do not specify which actual type the object they store is, so you have to essentially verify with any existing BigDB properties or hard-code each property to be it's proper type.

I accomplished this (mostly) by cross-verifying through taking an existing DatabaseObject and running it through my recursive ToDictionary function, wherein I then flattened the property name and any children, delimited by a period.
I also had to ensure that all byte array properties were accounted for since certain integers can be valid base-64 and there's no way to distinguish between base-64 or an integer unless it contains an alphabetic character and/or has a padding character.

In order to import any data by this method, not only would you have to wait for the export to complete (can sometimes take longer than 24 hours) but you'd have to manually scan the entire collection and compare it to the previous copy.
In certain instances, you might have to also manually pick out which ones were the correct ones, which in the case for worlds, is pretty much impossible or at least very impractical. It's not documented which world was cleared by a moderator on which date. It's also not documented when any IP bans were created, so you'd also have to manually find which users were legitimately wrongly affected by any particular moderator and which they appropriately banned.

Still though I don't think there was any reason to think Mega Lamb was about to go on any kind of rampage. No reason it couldn't have waited around for NVD.

I have a history of bad experiences, especially in relation to the previous administration. I can't assume those who act unreasonably towards one person don't have the capacity or aren't willing to do so with anyone else.
I think that if he were being reasonable, he'd speak to Niels about the affair rather than resigning purely out of disagreement and his hatred of me personally. I will take responsibility for my actions, and I'd expect the same from him.

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*u stinky*

Koto

Member

Joined: 2015-02-18

Posts: 3,269

Re: I am thankful

This game has definitely seen some wonky administration.

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mrjawapa

Corn Man 🌽

From: Ohio, USA

Joined: 2015-02-15

Posts: 5,840

Website

Re: I am thankful

&
Benjaminsen

our lord and savior

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Discord: jawp#5123

N1KF

Wiki Mod

From: ဪဪဪဪဪ From: ဪဪဪဪဪ From: ဪဪဪဪဪ

Joined: 2015-02-15

Posts: 11,098

Website

Re: I am thankful

I'll be surprised if these essay-long posts by Mega Lamb and Atilla lead the situation anywhere helpful.

mrjawapa

Corn Man 🌽

From: Ohio, USA

Joined: 2015-02-15

Posts: 5,840

Website

Re: I am thankful

I'll be surprised if these essay-long posts by Mega Lamb and Atilla lead the situation anywhere helpful.

I was about to say:

Megalamb, thank you for the transparency, but it's probably not a good idea to continue **** fighting arguing. Nothing you say will make a difference.

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Discord: jawp#5123

Master1

Member

From: Crait

Joined: 2015-02-15

Posts: 4,452

Re: I am thankful

I'll be surprised if these essay-long posts by Mega Lamb and Atilla lead the situation anywhere helpful.

I was about to say:

Megalamb, thank you for the transparency, but it's probably not a good idea to continue **** fighting arguing. Nothing you say will make a difference.

cAn ConFirM

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Tomahawk

Forum Mod

From: UK

Joined: 2015-02-18

Posts: 2,832

Re: I am thankful

Is this what happens when the owner leaves? Decision-making goes to hell because there's nobody left to say "we're doing it my way".

EE makes it especially difficult because - as the staff aren't employed - there's no guarantee they'll be online when needed to discuss issues and help make time-sensitive decisions.

If the mods were all like this, we'd never have drama. ^^

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One bot to rule them all, one bot to find them. One bot to bring them all... and with this cliché blind them.

John

Member

Joined: 2019-01-11

Posts: 1,975

Re: I am thankful

Emalton

?

It's sad to see you go, we'll miss you! Hopefully you'll continue to help out with campaigns, they're what's keeping this game alive.

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Kikikan

Member

From: Hungary

Joined: 2015-08-10

Posts: 204

Re: I am thankful

Conclusion: If you hire someone to work for you, discuss what he is allowed and not allowed to do.

John

Member

Joined: 2019-01-11

Posts: 1,975

Re: I am thankful

If you hire someone to work for you

It's unpaid work, keep in mind.

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iPwner

Member

From: CaliforNYAN Land.

Joined: 2015-02-15

Posts: 1,514

Website

Re: I am thankful

Official announcement: I can run the game if that position's currently up for grabs and do all the campaigns. ;-3 Free of charge! I may not have that "official" insignia that the "sophisticate" community endears so treasurely, but I have experience and overall reverberating proepicz under my buckle. SOYES!

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ssAARASAAAAAAAAA  iAAAAAAAAAAAAA OU yaaAAAAAAAAAAAAAA YAAAaa YAAaah; yaayaayaa, yayayaya-ya-ya YAAA YAAAYA; YAYAYA YAAHAYAhAAAAAAAAAA 

EPIOOOOOUUUUUUuuuuuu   IUO0O0oooooooooooppi

;3 0>o ~X_x~ <~(^V^)~> (); ;B ;~; *~<:',',',',',{ Q=(*@`)Q

Im A ®a®ity ®

Xenonetix

Past Owner

From: Moving on with my life

Joined: 2015-03-07

Posts: 899

Website

Re: I am thankful

I'll be surprised if these essay-long posts by Mega Lamb and Atilla lead the situation anywhere helpful.

I was about to say:

Megalamb, thank you for the transparency, but it's probably not a good idea to continue fighting/arguing. Nothing you say will make a difference.

Ok, I'll cut it down to the most vital points.

Bit confused here, it's not your place to handle moderators. When Proc was still around on the forums, I wouldn't expect him to start removing mods in this situation. Unless he's actively going on a rampage with no one else online I don't know why you'd step in.

It's not my job, nor any other developers or moderators, to handle staff members. It's entirely Niels's duty to do so.

Then stop handling me.

I temporarily revoked your moderator privileges.

What's classified as "temporarily" in your mind? Neither time did you reinstate them, suggesting that you did them permanently, and other people reversed your decision.
If you meant, "I permanently revoked your moderator privileges expecting someone else to reinstate them", then fine, although that would be suggesting you're trying to blame other people for your actions, expecting them to get involved when they shouldn't have to. If you were truly "taking responsibility for your own actions", you would have reinstated them while I was asleep.

Please don't go back to the argument of "It's not my job to reinstate them", when you know it was never "your job" to take them away in the first place.

What is your job?

I don't trust your claims, you've already directed stated towards NVD in private messages you've specified that, and I quote, "I'm not Kira - I'm not going to take out my staff frustrations on the community" - you did exactly that, you took out your frustrations on me and banned my community account.

Clearly, you misunderstood what I meant by "the community", as you do seem particularly self-involved as to think you are "the community", and the community is "you", and no one else, but that's your own problem to take up with a psychiatrist.

Either you are staff, and I took my staff frustrations out on staff (you), or you are a member of the community, and I took my community frustrations (over yourself alone) out on the single member of the community involved. Either way, I did not "take out my staff frustrations out on the community".

That doesn't make any sense whatsoever. You banned my community account for 99+ days, that's directly in-game related not 'outside of Everybody Edits'.

As is removing my in-game privileges over things that happened "outside of Everybody Edits".

The situation would have been sorted internally rather than you taking a tantrum, departing and then crying about how I wronged you, when in fact you directly attacked me.

You keep saying these things as if one didn't result in another. I only directly "attacked" you because you took away my moderator privileges, and you directly "attacked" me by calling me the N-word. Why are you allowed to be immune from your own rules?

I don't want the in-game moderators controlling and dictating my speech, nor vice versa.

Surprise, surprise.

I think it'd be fair to state that most people on the forums don't want to be banned in-game for something they said or a rule they broke on the forums, or on the Discord server.

Most people don't "want" to be banned at all. It's a punishment for a reason. Why should people get a lesser punishment because that's what they "want"?

You have been incredibly disrespectful towards your fellow staff members as well.
In this instance you're assuming that it is uncalled for.

How was calling me the N-word called for? How is it called for in ANY situation? The only way it is socially acceptable (that I know of) is to use it as a term of endearment between friends. We're not friends, and we never will be, which suggests you purely said it as an uncalled for attack. I've never been as disrespectful towards the staff members or the community as you have yourself.

I justify my actions. You haven't justified why you had decided to issue a 99 day ban on my community account for a comment outside the game.

We're never going to agree over this. You feel like you've justified your actions when I believe you haven't. I feel like I've justified my actions when you believe I haven't. Might as well leave it at that over those actions.

You took that action without consulting Phinarose or any of the other staff prior, just like how you banned Thegame and Ogotu.

We've been through this. I did. Most staff members ignored my line of questioning, and I clearly announced TheGame should be banned. No point going over it again.

As for Ogotu, I accepted that could have been a mistake, and dropped the subject - Please stop roping him into the group of people who were banned, considering his involvement in this whole thing was far inferior to TheGame's and Abysmal's. As far as I can tell, the only reason you keep bring Ogotu up again is to make me sound like a worse person than I am.

I haven't punished anyone for disagreeing with me. You have, however.

You don't consider removing my modship as a punishment? Wouldn't you have taken removal of your power as a punishment if our roles were reversed?

To simplify this a little, although I know you don't need it simplified - Before you were given developer powers: Let's say a user called '69AtillaSucks69' is roaming Everybody Edits spamming "Atilla Sucks" everywhere (or, obviously, much worse). Any regular community member would "Report Abuse" as an inappropriate username or for spamming, and a moderator would probably ban the account. If a moderator were to see it, they would ban them anyway. If you see it, I feel like you're far more likely to hack their account, find out their IP address, find out alternative accounts they have, track down email accounts, hack into their email accounts, delete many of their emails, possibly send a bunch of inappropriate emails out for a laugh, and if they'd really **** you off, you'd find a way to hack into their bank accounts and steal money from them anonymously, but probably not given to yourself, but by spending it on something lavish that ends up being delivered to an offshore island somewhere for you to pick up in 7 years' time.

No, there have been people that have done exactly that and I didn't do anything against them nor would I.
I wouldn't damage their property or steal money from anyone either, what's with the ludicrous hypotheticals and defamation?

I didn't say you DO that. I said you come across as the SORT of person who WOULD do that. That's the reputation you've built up amongst the community, whether you would do it or not. I don't believe you actually do that, and if you do, that's your own business and problem.

If they're terrified of me it's almost certainly because they hear absurd rhetoric from people like yourself that I'm 'far more likely to steal their money and deliver it to an offshore island' and the like.

I used to be terrified of you. The fact my own financial situation is in such dire straits right now is one of the only reasons I'm no longer terrified of you. That's my own problem, but I'm at a stage in my life where, even if I were to reveal everything about myself, I don't believe anyone would be able to make things situationally much worse than they currently are. But those are my own personal concerns, but it does mean I have nothing to worry about when it comes to hackers hacking me.

The people that know me personally aren't intimidated by me, or at least they certainly don't act like it.

I wish I knew you personally then.

I have many friends who trust me, and I wouldn't want to instantly lose their respect and ruin friendships over that.

Good.

I don't have strict anonymity on my Atilla Lonny alias, it'd be a trivial exercise to track me down for any criminal activity.

Mostly, if someone has nothing to hide, they wouldn't use an alias without revealing their full name. I'm not asking you to reveal your full name, but it comes across as suspicious when someone wants to say so anonymous.

I'm not concerned with why you banned me.

If that were true, you wouldn't have removed the modship. You must have been concerned in some manner to retaliate.

I can't be expected to catch every single revision of every world - nor would I find it acceptable to allow you to do so regardless. It'd be an incredibly painsteaking effort that could have been easily prevented by temporarily revoking moderator privileges until you spoke to Niels.

How's the painstaking effort of dealing with this backlash going for you instead?

You should have waited until he was online, and consulted with him.

Why should I have waited until he was online and you shouldn't have?

In the screenshot, he said he'll pass it on to me - yet he never did.

Then you can take that up with NVD yourself, but that would suggest NVD is partially to blame, as I trusted NVD to speak to you about it as he said he would.

You were offline for an unreasonably long period of time

If I was offline for an unreasonably long period of time, how could I have been an 'immediate' danger to Everybody Edits and its community that required removal of my modship immediately without discussion?

I didn't say I was a "fellow moderator" - I am explicitly referring to Phinarose, benje00 and lrussell. My lord.

None of whom have the ability to remove moderator privileges, which was a decision actively made by NVD, Jesse, and Showpath, so that such incidences would be discussed BEFORE the choice to remove modship or reverse bans, instead of going ahead with it of their own accord.

You didn't say anything about banning Thegame for 40 days. You merely stated that you think they should be banned.

...for a "VERY long time". What in your mind is a "VERY long time" quantifiably? If anything, 40 days was a short period of time in the grand scheme of things.

You didn't discuss it at length prior to taking any action in this instance.

I tried. Jesse didn't care. Showpath talked about it to some extent. If I hadn't discussed it at all, I would have just banned him the moment I said he should be banned, and I didn't for many days due to having further discussions. Just because I didn't discuss it with you doesn't mean it wasn't discussed.

Why is it then that you banned my community account for 99 days without discussing it with any other moderator or administrator.

To prove the point I mentioned earlier. Both you and I know that banning your account is a meaningless ban, because you could reverse it anyway. It's not the same as banning a regular community member. If I'd banned you for 16 hours, you still would have reversed it before the 16 hours were up. The length of time was meaningless, and the ban itself was meaningless, but it was an action made to prove a point. It didn't need discussion.

Why is it that you banned Thegame for 40 days without discussing how specifically long the ban duration should be?

I stated to Showpath that I believed it was justified to ban TheGame for at least 6 times the length of time Abysmal was to be banned. Phina had only asked for feedback and suggestions over the length of Abysmal's ban, and we gave her that feedback. I never felt the need to discuss TheGame's ban length, just like. as I said before, we don't discuss every single person's ban for every single length of time. If I had followed through with my original ban length, it would have been for 84 days, and Showpath convinced me that was probably too long, so it was reduced to 40. Similarly, you believed Abysmal should have been banned for 30-40 days, and I said 7-10 days, and Phina decided to go for 14. If the compromise I had suggested had been met, both of them would have been banned for the same length of time.

Why is it that you discussed with Ernesdo and insisted upon him doing work on behalf of Everybody Edits, without taking it up with any of us?

As mentioned prior, he always approached me. I've explained this, and really don't need to go into it again. I try taking things up with "any of you", and most of you ignore me. That's your problem, not mine.

Except I'm not. I haven't been recognized in any way offically, and upon agreeing to help with development I made it clear that I didn't want to be.

So if you're not an official developer, stop officially developing. NVD, please remove Atilla's developer privileges.

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N1KF

Wiki Mod

From: ဪဪဪဪဪ From: ဪဪဪဪဪ From: ဪဪဪဪဪ

Joined: 2015-02-15

Posts: 11,098

Website

Re: I am thankful

My important question hasn't been answered yet:

As far as I am aware, Unity was finished a long time ago, ready for launch, but Unity costs a lot more to run and serve than Flash does, so unless there is any investor funding, Unity is an unreasonable option as a business decision in the current state of the game.

What about the HTML5 version?

Ok, I'll cut it down to the most vital points.

Six screens of text isn't much better than nine screens of text...

I counted over twenty-five quotes in your post. You aren't going to get anywhere by juggling that many different arguments.

Xenonetix

Past Owner

From: Moving on with my life

Joined: 2015-03-07

Posts: 899

Website

Re: I am thankful

My important question hasn't been answered yet:

What about the HTML5 version?

There's an HTML5 version?

Ok, I'll cut it down to the most vital points.

Six screens of text isn't much better than nine screens of text...

I counted over twenty-five quotes in your post. You aren't going to get anywhere by juggling that many different arguments.

Believe it or not, that's the condensed version of what that post could have been

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Zumza

Member

From: root

Joined: 2015-02-17

Posts: 4,645

Re: I am thankful

Unity is finished? Where is it then? Is EE going to revive?

As far as I am aware, Unity was finished a long time ago, ready for launch, but Unity costs a lot more to run and serve than Flash does, so unless there is any investor funding, Unity is an unreasonable option as a business decision in the current state of the game.

My important question hasn't been answered yet:
What about the HTML5 version?

My imagination is limited to why would the Unity version be more costly than Flash. PlayerIO is not providing differential prices by the type of technology used.
And as I knew the Unity version of EE still wasn't successfully tested in-browser but only as a standalone executable.

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Everybody edits, but some edit more than others

John

Member

Joined: 2019-01-11

Posts: 1,975

Re: I am thankful

the Unity version of EE still wasn't successfully tested in-browser but only as a standalone executable.

Can confirm, there were only executable builds. The Unity client also relied on BotBits as well.

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N1KF

Wiki Mod

From: ဪဪဪဪဪ From: ဪဪဪဪဪ From: ဪဪဪဪဪ

Joined: 2015-02-15

Posts: 11,098

Website

Re: I am thankful

My important question hasn't been answered yet:

What about the HTML5 version?

There's an HTML5 version?

I find it mindboggling that you don't know about this at all. Nou was very clear about this in the UnitEE announcement topic:

Why Unity and not HTML5? The major advantage of Unity is that it's a cross-platform engine. In other words, you will be able to play the game on your phones and tablets! Everybody Edits will still be available on the main website as it is now. We are aware of the concerns about the Unity Web Player being inefficient and it no longer being supported by Google Chrome, but we will be using the WebGL player for the website, which works a lot better. Essentially, Unity compiles C# into javascript, meaning we will have both html5 and Unity without the need for a runtime. I hope you trust we can do this properly and that it puts your concerns to rest.

In addition, we will also offer a stand-alone client to play on your desktop, plus we will look into getting this client on Steam to open it up to a whole new market and get in a great amount of new players.

TO ITERATE: THE GAME WILL RUN AS HTML5 ON WEBSITES. THIS MEANS THAT YOU WILL NOT BE AFFECTED, DO NOT NEED TO INSTALL ANYTHING, AND YOU CAN KEEP PLAYING IN ALL BROWSERS LIKE NORMAL. STOP PANICKING. YOU CAN CHOOSE TO USE THE STANDALONE UNITY CLIENT, BUT DON'T HAVE TO!

Different55

Forum Admin

Joined: 2015-02-07

Posts: 16,574

Re: I am thankful

My important question hasn't been answered yet:

What about the HTML5 version?

There's an HTML5 version?

I find it mindboggling that you don't know about this at all. Nou was very clear about this in the UnitEE announcement topic:

Why Unity and not HTML5? The major advantage of Unity is that it's a cross-platform engine. In other words, you will be able to play the game on your phones and tablets! Everybody Edits will still be available on the main website as it is now. We are aware of the concerns about the Unity Web Player being inefficient and it no longer being supported by Google Chrome, but we will be using the WebGL player for the website, which works a lot better. Essentially, Unity compiles C# into javascript, meaning we will have both html5 and Unity without the need for a runtime. I hope you trust we can do this properly and that it puts your concerns to rest.

In addition, we will also offer a stand-alone client to play on your desktop, plus we will look into getting this client on Steam to open it up to a whole new market and get in a great amount of new players.

TO ITERATE: THE GAME WILL RUN AS HTML5 ON WEBSITES. THIS MEANS THAT YOU WILL NOT BE AFFECTED, DO NOT NEED TO INSTALL ANYTHING, AND YOU CAN KEEP PLAYING IN ALL BROWSERS LIKE NORMAL. STOP PANICKING. YOU CAN CHOOSE TO USE THE STANDALONE UNITY CLIENT, BUT DON'T HAVE TO!

That's still just the unity version. Unity allows exporting as HTML5, so while it's going to end up as a separate "version", behind the scenes it'll still all be the same game.

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"Sometimes failing a leap of faith is better than inching forward"
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Zoey2070

Moderation Team

From: Shakuras

Joined: 2015-02-15

Posts: 5,504

Re: I am thankful

so when is atilla going to either be made publicly a member of the staff and held accountable for his actions (in-game, too) or be removed from staff for abusing his powers

seems like he's stated that he had no right or jurisdiction to remove megalamb's powers yet did so anyways because of his own trust issues. he has a "community" account because he wants all the privileges of being a staff member but none of the accountability.

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John

Member

Joined: 2019-01-11

Posts: 1,975

Re: I am thankful

I find it mindboggling that you don't know about this at all.

Nou was talking about exporting the Unity project to HTML5. They're not creating a separate client using HTML5 as would be pretty idiotic if they're using Unity.

EDIT:

Huh, I should've refreshed before I replied.

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mrjawapa

Corn Man 🌽

From: Ohio, USA

Joined: 2015-02-15

Posts: 5,840

Website

Re: I am thankful

wants all the privileges of being a staff member but none of the accountability

Sounds a little hypocritical: make others be accountable for their actions, even over stepping his bounds to do so, but doing everything possible to avoid being held accountable for his own actions.

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