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#51 2018-05-03 19:41:40

Enurp
Formerly ThuggishPrune
From: Ohio
Joined: 2015-06-20
Posts: 456

Re: A bare minimum of grammar on the forums.

azurepudding wrote:

call me what you want, but you guys know what you are doing so stop acting as if you're completely clueless.

Oh my god please play victim more, IM SO CLOSE

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#52 2018-05-03 20:59:05

Translator
Banned
Joined: 2018-05-03
Posts: 19

Re: A bare minimum of grammar on the forums.

I will be of assistance deciphering people's posts. //forums.everybodyedits.com/img/smilies/wink

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#53 2018-05-03 21:01:42

LukeM
Dev Team
From: England
Joined: 2016-06-03
Posts: 2,902
Website

Re: A bare minimum of grammar on the forums.

I might have said that the translations were useful, but only when they actually need it //forums.everybodyedits.com/img/smilies/tongue That might be taking it a bit too far...

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#54 2018-05-03 21:04:59

Enurp
Formerly ThuggishPrune
From: Ohio
Joined: 2015-06-20
Posts: 456

Re: A bare minimum of grammar on the forums.

Translator wrote:

I will be of assistance deciphering people's posts. //forums.everybodyedits.com/img/smilies/wink

ru omo trpiel yag

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#55 2018-05-03 21:13:39

Luka504
Member
From: Serbia,probs never heard of it
Joined: 2015-02-19
Posts: 2,645

Re: A bare minimum of grammar on the forums.

Translator wrote:

I will be of assistance deciphering people's posts. //forums.everybodyedits.com/img/smilies/wink

This makes me feel kinda uneasy. Like I know that I want the bad grammar issue to be resolved but I don't know if following peace around like a stalker and fixing his grammar in every post is an adequate solution.


How long will it take me to get banned again?
Place your bets right here.

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#56 2018-05-03 21:17:57

TaskManager
Formerly maxi123
From: i really should update this
Joined: 2015-03-01
Posts: 8,418

Re: A bare minimum of grammar on the forums.

Luka504 wrote:
Translator wrote:

I will be of assistance deciphering people's posts. //forums.everybodyedits.com/img/smilies/wink

This makes me feel kinda uneasy. Like I know that I want the bad grammar issue to be resolved but I don't know if following peace around like a stalker and fixing his grammar in every post is an adequate solution.

heres an adequate sollution for you mate

TaskManager wrote:

in my opinion, the easiest and most harmless thing that you can do about it is to simply not read his posts. if he wants to be heard by people, that will give him incentive to put more meaning into his text, if he doesn't really care then he will just move on with his life and stop posting here.


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#57 2018-05-03 21:22:44

Translator
Banned
Joined: 2018-05-03
Posts: 19

Re: A bare minimum of grammar on the forums.

Luka504 wrote:

I want the bad grammar issue to be resolved

As we all do.

Luka504 wrote:

I don't know if following peace around like a stalker and fixing his grammar in every post is an adequate solution.

I completely agree, I hope this will show the forum admins how pathetic all of this is and change the rules to force "coherent" thoughts. Hopefully it will put some pressure users who should improve their grammar as well. I will only decipher the posts that need to be deciphered, so if there's no need then I will not be doing it.

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#58 2018-05-03 21:29:16, last edited by hummerz5 (2018-05-04 01:16:52)

hummerz5
Member
From: wait I'm not a secret mod huh
Joined: 2015-08-10
Posts: 5,795

Re: A bare minimum of grammar on the forums.

Translator wrote:

I completely agree, I hope this will show the forum admins how pathetic all of this is and change the rules to force "coherent" thoughts. Hopefully it will put some pressure users who should improve their grammar as well. I will only decipher the posts that need to be deciphered, so if there's no need then I will not be doing it.

for the record, I'm not sure what point you're making. You've been recognized as an alternate account but someone's deemed that OK

so I guess if you were expecting a quick response... it's not happening in your favor

but I do appreciate the attempt. personally I find incomprehensible messages a pain.

also hmm

Ratburntro44 wrote:

if it's bad enough to be legitimately unreadable then it should already fall under the rules about spam

edit:
turns out I think that was an automated thing. so

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#59 2018-05-03 23:20:37

azurepudding
Member
Joined: 2016-11-18
Posts: 726

Re: A bare minimum of grammar on the forums.

Onjit wrote:
Enurp wrote:
azurepudding wrote:

do you know that?

and no that is not what is happening, people are being mean and RUDE about it and that is not the same as politely asking like you just pretended there that was happening.

So some people here aren't first language english speakers.. so it'd make sense that some people wouldn't type perfect english, right?  How can you argue that highly decent spelling is necessary but also argue "think of those who don't have english as their main language"?

And I really doubt that so many people struggle THAT hard, it's just "fun" to have someone to pick on apparently and even moderators and admins are joining in as well.  it's pretty shameful how this can be allowed.  as seen in this thread itself, people have begun mocking him and not a thing is being done about it.  forget whether or not peace is dyslexic or if he's new or not to the language.  regardless of what reason, these responses still fall under bullying and you are condoning it.

I'm not calling anyone dumb here, but lazy, mean, and rude.  And toxic.

Wow please lecture us on how you are a better person and we are obviously bullies some more please.

This brand of aggressive moral superiority and insidious wholesomeness reminds me of someone who has (thankfully) since toned it down...

Maybe I am coming off too aggressive about it, but if I catch people on their crap, of course I'm gonna seem to be the morally superior one.  And now that I have caught people on their crap, they're getting all upset over it for some reason.

Luka504 wrote:

I'm pretty sure peace isn't dyslexic. He has written a lot of words properly in the past, occasionally he wrote whole sentences with no grammatical issues other than forgetting to add apostrophes or commas. And even when he does screw up, he usually adds a letter to a word that doesn't need it or some letters in a word are swapped. In terms of raw spelling, he isn't too bad. He just refuses to use spellcheck.

However, the issue lies within how peace structures his posts. No capital letters, extremely rare punctuation, lack of coherency with his words and no paragraph spacing. All of this just adds to a really mushy and ugly post. This, in turn, lead to people just ignoring what peace has to say, and whenever they see peace's avatar on a post they just automatically dismiss whatever he has to say. I read pretty much every single post on the forums, yet whenever I see peace I just can't be bothered to decipher what he is trying to say.

I also find it pretty ironic how you keep calling people mean and rude when you are acting pretty rudely yourself there. With the exception of ThuggishPrune with his purposefully misspelled posts, everyone here has been pretty civilized and no one mocked or bullied Peace, yet you keep saying that everyone who wants peace to re-read what he posts is a bully. Spoiler alert: They're not.
We shouldn't just ignore this issue like you seem to be suggesting. You can't solve an issue of an individual by changing everybody else. That isn't how it works.

But that sounds exactly what a minor form of dyslexia is.  When you have words or letters swapped around and letters not belonging in a word.  Dyslexia doesn't always mean "entirely unable to read," though it can mean that.  A dyslexic person can be able to write out a few lines with no or little error if the words they use are simple enough or are ones they know.

I have a sibling with dyslexia and so I know that it's NOT something people like to let others know about, because it's often embarrassing for them.  To be a grown adult, but be unable to read at the same level as others of your age, or maybe not at all.  A 21 year old with the reading and writing skill of a kindergartener for example.  It's tough too, having to ask others for help all the time.  It's technically a disability, and it's not cool to pick on someone for that.  It's like laughing and mocking someone in a wheel chair.  That's kind of how I see this here.

I will agree that he could work on paragraph spacing, as that is a simple thing to do which doesn't require any level of reading ability.  But the actual words themselves I think are at least 95% readability. 

Everyone who likes a bully post I group with the bully because that's enabling the bullying.  The constant correction posts can also fall under harrassment as more than half the time they're not purposely helping the guy, but to mock and show off his errors.  And even yourself, having written this thread, "Now I get that English is not everyone's first language and I perfectly understand that it is a hard language to learn and master.  But I also don't care."  You made this to call him out rather than taking the more helpful route of messaging him and trying to help the guy out.  No, you wanted to make a public thread to embarrass him, and squeak by by technically not mentioning him by name, but made it clear enough who you were speaking of.  "I won't say any specific names, however I think you all know precisely who I am talking about."

I didn't say that everyone who wants him to reread is a bully, so please do not put words in my mouth.  I am calling those who mock and harrass him the bullies, as well as the enablers.  Mods and admins too are joining in on this which is especially disappointing.

Being of the majority doesn't necessarily put you in the right, and that the minority must be in the wrong.  Everyone here is greatly exaggerating peace's typing ability.  It's a little harder to read but not that much.  He just really should try paragraph spacing.  But anyway, that does not excuse bullying and harrassing him. 

So yes, it's "everybody else" who can change.  But peace can change a little bit with spacing, and over time he might improve his English as well.  I do want to point out that positive reinforcement is a great way to help someone out.  But all I see is mocking and harrassing and insulting and putting the guy down.  How is he going to strive to get better when everyone keeps tearing him down?  Even with this thread, you want him to get warnings and possibly bans.  Don't you see a problem here?

Enurp wrote:
azurepudding wrote:

call me what you want, but you guys know what you are doing so stop acting as if you're completely clueless.

Oh my god please play victim more, IM SO CLOSE

Aren't you guys playing the victim with how it's soooo hard for you to read these posts?  You guys are making peace the victim.  It is your own fault.  I am not responsible for your actions.

Luka504 wrote:
Translator wrote:

I will be of assistance deciphering people's posts. //forums.everybodyedits.com/img/smilies/wink

This makes me feel kinda uneasy. Like I know that I want the bad grammar issue to be resolved but I don't know if following peace around like a stalker and fixing his grammar in every post is an adequate solution.

We can agree on this at least.  It's another form of harrassment.


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#60 2018-05-03 23:57:50

Kirby
Campaign Team
Joined: 2015-04-04
Posts: 4,194

Re: A bare minimum of grammar on the forums.

^pretty sure someone with dyslexia isn't colorblind as well, and can still see the color red underlining half of what they type

also when he was asked to just "look at your post a second time before you post it" his response was literally "eh nope". You can "diagnose" him with whatever you'd like, but being unwilling to put any effort into changing can't be attributed to dyslexia

as for you saying that it's "not that hard to read", i beg to differ

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#61 2018-05-04 00:10:42

azurepudding
Member
Joined: 2016-11-18
Posts: 726

Re: A bare minimum of grammar on the forums.

Kirby wrote:

^pretty sure someone with dyslexia isn't colorblind as well, and can still see the color red underlining half of what they type

also when he was asked to just "look at your post a second time before you post it" his response was literally "eh nope". You can "diagnose" him with whatever you'd like, but being unwilling to put any effort into changing can't be attributed to dyslexia

as for you saying that it's "not that hard to read", i beg to differ

you can be dyslexic and colorblind, but anyway, reading back over is when you search for typos, and I do not think he is making typos.

and man I thought you were going to link some actually difficult to read posts there for a second.  like they don't read as fluently as they could be but they are definitely readable.


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#62 2018-05-04 00:15:09

Kirby
Campaign Team
Joined: 2015-04-04
Posts: 4,194

Re: A bare minimum of grammar on the forums.

azurepudding wrote:
Kirby wrote:

^pretty sure someone with dyslexia isn't colorblind as well, and can still see the color red underlining half of what they type

also when he was asked to just "look at your post a second time before you post it" his response was literally "eh nope". You can "diagnose" him with whatever you'd like, but being unwilling to put any effort into changing can't be attributed to dyslexia

as for you saying that it's "not that hard to read", i beg to differ

you can be dyslexic and colorblind, but anyway, reading back over is when you search for typos, and I do not think he is making typos.

and man I thought you were going to link some actually difficult to read posts there for a second.  like they don't read as fluently as they could be but they are definitely readable.

dude even if he thinks it's how it's spelled he can still just use the suggested word on any spellchecker

also, please understand that not everyone is as amazing and perfect as reading english as you are. some people - get this - aren't native speakers. Crazy, right, that peace isn't the only one?

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#63 2018-05-04 00:20:24

azurepudding
Member
Joined: 2016-11-18
Posts: 726

Re: A bare minimum of grammar on the forums.

Kirby wrote:
azurepudding wrote:
Kirby wrote:

^pretty sure someone with dyslexia isn't colorblind as well, and can still see the color red underlining half of what they type

also when he was asked to just "look at your post a second time before you post it" his response was literally "eh nope". You can "diagnose" him with whatever you'd like, but being unwilling to put any effort into changing can't be attributed to dyslexia

as for you saying that it's "not that hard to read", i beg to differ

you can be dyslexic and colorblind, but anyway, reading back over is when you search for typos, and I do not think he is making typos.

and man I thought you were going to link some actually difficult to read posts there for a second.  like they don't read as fluently as they could be but they are definitely readable.

dude even if he thinks it's how it's spelled he can still just use the suggested word on any spellchecker

also, please understand that not everyone is as amazing and perfect as reading english as you are. some people - get this - aren't native speakers. Crazy, right, that peace isn't the only one?

it'd probably take him more time to correct every word than it would take for someone to read the post, but if he wants to he can use one to see the spellings of the words he types.  it's not really fair to have a rule forcing spell check though.

and since you acknowledge that not everyone here is perfect at reading and writing English, peace too falls under that category and we shouldn't be shaming him for trying.  encourage people to get better, don't tear them down.


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#64 2018-05-04 00:27:27

Kirby
Campaign Team
Joined: 2015-04-04
Posts: 4,194

Re: A bare minimum of grammar on the forums.

azurepudding wrote:
Kirby wrote:
azurepudding wrote:
Kirby wrote:

^pretty sure someone with dyslexia isn't colorblind as well, and can still see the color red underlining half of what they type

also when he was asked to just "look at your post a second time before you post it" his response was literally "eh nope". You can "diagnose" him with whatever you'd like, but being unwilling to put any effort into changing can't be attributed to dyslexia

as for you saying that it's "not that hard to read", i beg to differ

you can be dyslexic and colorblind, but anyway, reading back over is when you search for typos, and I do not think he is making typos.

and man I thought you were going to link some actually difficult to read posts there for a second.  like they don't read as fluently as they could be but they are definitely readable.

dude even if he thinks it's how it's spelled he can still just use the suggested word on any spellchecker

also, please understand that not everyone is as amazing and perfect as reading english as you are. some people - get this - aren't native speakers. Crazy, right, that peace isn't the only one?

it'd probably take him more time to correct every word than it would take for someone to read the post, but if he wants to he can use one to see the spellings of the words he types.  it's not really fair to have a rule forcing spell check though.

and since you acknowledge that not everyone here is perfect at reading and writing English, peace too falls under that category and we shouldn't be shaming him for trying.  encourage people to get better, don't tear them down.

The difference is, his spelling is the primary source of trouble. I'd understand if it was grammar that he was having trouble with, but his spelling just makes it look like he's smashing his keyboard. This is frustrating, as it's SO easily preventable.

This forum has a LOT of users who don't have English as their first language, with at least 5 of them having posted at least once in this thread. They may mess up on grammar here and there, and have the occasional honest mistake, but they're trying. Peace was asked nicely to try a little harder many times. But he's on post number 1345 now. People are getting tired of it.

(btw if it takes him less time to write his post than it takes someone to read it, that's definitely a problem)

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#65 2018-05-04 00:39:44

azurepudding
Member
Joined: 2016-11-18
Posts: 726

Re: A bare minimum of grammar on the forums.

Kirby wrote:
azurepudding wrote:
Kirby wrote:
azurepudding wrote:
Kirby wrote:

^pretty sure someone with dyslexia isn't colorblind as well, and can still see the color red underlining half of what they type

also when he was asked to just "look at your post a second time before you post it" his response was literally "eh nope". You can "diagnose" him with whatever you'd like, but being unwilling to put any effort into changing can't be attributed to dyslexia

as for you saying that it's "not that hard to read", i beg to differ

you can be dyslexic and colorblind, but anyway, reading back over is when you search for typos, and I do not think he is making typos.

and man I thought you were going to link some actually difficult to read posts there for a second.  like they don't read as fluently as they could be but they are definitely readable.

dude even if he thinks it's how it's spelled he can still just use the suggested word on any spellchecker

also, please understand that not everyone is as amazing and perfect as reading english as you are. some people - get this - aren't native speakers. Crazy, right, that peace isn't the only one?

it'd probably take him more time to correct every word than it would take for someone to read the post, but if he wants to he can use one to see the spellings of the words he types.  it's not really fair to have a rule forcing spell check though.

and since you acknowledge that not everyone here is perfect at reading and writing English, peace too falls under that category and we shouldn't be shaming him for trying.  encourage people to get better, don't tear them down.

The difference is, his spelling is the primary source of trouble. I'd understand if it was grammar that he was having trouble with, but his spelling just makes it look like he's smashing his keyboard. This is frustrating, as it's SO easily preventable.

This forum has a LOT of users who don't have English as their first language, with at least 5 of them having posted at least once in this thread. They may mess up on grammar here and there, and have the occasional honest mistake, but they're trying. Peace was asked nicely to try a little harder many times. But he's on post number 1345 now. People are getting tired of it.

(btw if it takes him less time to write his post than it takes someone to read it, that's definitely a problem)

I would like to know why so many people here keep dismissing the reason of dyslexia, because he's shown clear signs of it.  It is readable, he just could help us out with more line breaks as he tends to write huge blocks of text.  When paragraphs are made, you might find that his typing is actually a lot easier to read then.

And I meant that, since he tends to write long posts, having to go back and right click on almost every word to select the write spelling would take a lot of time, when a reader can figure out what he meant much quicker.  Though, doing so could help him with spelling, but I don't think it needs to be a mandatory thing where failure to spell check results in a warning or ban.  I have not seen anywhere else on the internet try to crack down so strictly with spelling like what is being proposed here.  I just see a lot of elitist snobbishness going around, and now there's even an alt made for the specific reason of translating his posts.  I mean, I don't know what you guys want me to say.  "You win"?  That we should ban peace and anyone else who doesn't have near perfect English?  That we should enact an anti-dyslexia rule?  you do not grow and maintain a healthy community by shutting fans out like this.


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#66 2018-05-04 00:47:50, last edited by Koto (2018-05-04 00:56:21)

Koto
Member
Joined: 2015-02-18
Posts: 3,259

Re: A bare minimum of grammar on the forums.

Gosha wrote:

looks like description of https://www.reddit.com/

We had experience with reputation points before, wasn't pretty useful

Maybe something like Reddit Gold could work in this situation?

Edit: Holy crap, I just looked through the rest of the topic.  I think it's fairly probable that they could be dyslexic.  I have seen their posts.  I think it's readable, and there's no reason to be rude like this.  I can read them, and I'd rather have not push away the members of the community that are here.


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#67 2018-05-04 01:28:31

Enurp
Formerly ThuggishPrune
From: Ohio
Joined: 2015-06-20
Posts: 456

Re: A bare minimum of grammar on the forums.

Yes, let's diagnose him with dyslexia because we all have spent 8 years going to a medical school so we can win an argument online.

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#68 2018-05-04 01:48:23

azurepudding
Member
Joined: 2016-11-18
Posts: 726

Re: A bare minimum of grammar on the forums.

Koto wrote:
Gosha wrote:

looks like description of https://www.reddit.com/

We had experience with reputation points before, wasn't pretty useful

Maybe something like Reddit Gold could work in this situation?

Edit: Holy crap, I just looked through the rest of the topic.  I think it's fairly probable that they could be dyslexic.  I have seen their posts.  I think it's readable, and there's no reason to be rude like this.  I can read them, and I'd rather have not push away the members of the community that are here.

I ran out of woots today //forums.everybodyedits.com/img/smilies/tongue

Enurp wrote:

Yes, let's diagnose him with dyslexia because we all have spent 8 years going to a medical school so we can win an argument online.

hey you don't know if I have or not //forums.everybodyedits.com/img/smilies/tongue

also it seems incredibly unlikely that he purposely types wrong for a thousand+ posts.  purposely typing wrong takes much more effort than typing correctly, and after a thousand posts, dyslexia seems like the most likely reason. 

but i mean you argue that i am assuming that, but you are assuming he isn't, and are mocking and insulting him for his typing.  And somehow I'm the wrong one.


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#69 2018-05-04 02:00:19

Enurp
Formerly ThuggishPrune
From: Ohio
Joined: 2015-06-20
Posts: 456

Re: A bare minimum of grammar on the forums.

I chose to delete my last response. We aren't gonna get far arguing back and forth like this.

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#70 2018-05-04 02:07:44, last edited by azurepudding (2018-05-04 02:08:38)

azurepudding
Member
Joined: 2016-11-18
Posts: 726

Re: A bare minimum of grammar on the forums.

Oh, ok.


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#71 2018-05-04 02:14:43

Koto
Member
Joined: 2015-02-18
Posts: 3,259

Re: A bare minimum of grammar on the forums.

Look, man.  The game is called Everybody Edits, and people can play this all over the world.  Since this is the official forum, we represent the community.  I think the community (not anybody in particular) needs to do better.  You come onto the forums, and the first thing a new user is probably going to see is "Demod ______" "ban _____".  It makes the community look toxic and therefore makes the game worse off than it should be.


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#72 2018-05-04 04:09:44

Xfrogman43
Member
From: need to find a new home
Joined: 2015-02-15
Posts: 4,173

Re: A bare minimum of grammar on the forums.

why dont you just ask peace why he does what he does


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#73 2018-05-04 04:19:13

Slabdrill
Formerly 12345678908642
From: canada
Joined: 2015-08-15
Posts: 3,323
Website

Re: A bare minimum of grammar on the forums.

In the posts I have translated something peace posted, it was due to people complaining that they couldn't read it. I shamed the people who complain about that, not peace themselves.

I have never had much trouble reading peace's posts, and I usually understand the message regardless.

speling is mabe no hrad to unerstnad fi its sgificatn but rly tihs shoudlnt be too haard to unedrtsadn, and that's a far higher error density than found in peace's posts.


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#74 2018-05-04 07:11:29

TundrumMax
Formerly Memomemo
Joined: 2017-10-26
Posts: 324

Re: A bare minimum of grammar on the forums.

Reminder that dyslexia isn't just typing bad, it's also reading badly. So how come peace can read our posts so easily?


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#75 2018-05-04 08:10:39, last edited by LukeM (2018-05-04 08:13:48)

LukeM
Dev Team
From: England
Joined: 2016-06-03
Posts: 2,902
Website

Re: A bare minimum of grammar on the forums.

Why are you so sure peace has dyslexia?
Firstly, dyslexia is the incorrect spelling of words, not lack of punctuation and incorrect placing of spaces (e.g. means 'I have a suggestion.' types 'ih ave as uggestion')
Secondly, you can't have dyslexia so bad you make as many mistakes as peace can you?

azurepudding wrote:

also it seems incredibly unlikely that he purposely types wrong for a thousand+ posts.  purposely typing wrong takes much more effort than typing correctly, and after a thousand posts, dyslexia seems like the most likely reason.

There are more options than 'has crippling dyslexia' and 'types incorrectly purposely' lol
What I find much more likely is that he just types as fast as he can, so makes a lot of typos accidentally //forums.everybodyedits.com/img/smilies/tongue
You can pretty much simulate what peace does by looking down at the keyboard and typing as fast as you possibly can (and pressing send without looking at what you typed)

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