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Calicara

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Sexism in Comics

I'm not ignorant to the cries of sexism in the comic book industry, however let it known I have never been a fan of DC or Marvel and so I am unaware as to their portrayal of female characters in their comics. I happened to come across this picture via Facebook, and though I realize I'm sure this isn't the only example of sexism in comics, I was shocked. Not only is the anatomy of the girl on the left horribly inaccurate, but her body is skinner than a barbie doll. My question to the forumers is that, do you think it's ok for the comic book industry to portray unrealistic images of girls? Why?
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My opinion is that while I am for freedom of expression, I think there needs to be a line drawn for portrayal of female characters in kids comic books. I think if females want to look se xy it's ok, but at the same time I think it's important for people to understand skinny doesn't equate to beauty. Beauty is something human, something we create and define and is often only skin deep. This is not to say you can't be beautiful and genuine, but beauty is in the eye of the beholder. If kids are subjected to the same stick figure white skinned models of woman in the comics with heroes they idolize, it will give them a false sense of what is and isn't beautiful.
Fat people can be beautiful, people of different cultures can be beautiful, girls with short hair can be beautiful, girls who are skinny can be beautiful, and girls with long hair can be beautiful. We shouldn't let comics limit the image of the definition of beauty.

Last edited by Calicara (May 4 2014 9:22:50 pm)

Tachyonic

Guest

Re: Sexism in Comics

Comics aren't meant to be taken seriously in regards to aesthetics. I don't think the creators intend to create a statement describing the correlation between weight and appeal, but rather it just so happens to be their style and method of drawing.

Last edited by Tachyonic (May 4 2014 9:31:09 pm)

mrjawapa

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From: Ohio, USA

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Re: Sexism in Comics

1) Marvel over DC... any day.
2) Most older comic books you see are going to show girls as being very skinny and beautiful. But lets face it Spider-man trying to save a 450lb girl is not going to make a good story.
3)The girl in the comic book picture is meant to catch the eye of 12 year old testosterone loaded boys. who are willing to bang a toaster.

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Koto

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Re: Sexism in Comics

2) Most older comic books you see are going to show girls as being very skinny and beautiful. But lets face it Spider-man trying to save a 450lb girl is not going to make a good story.

Imo that would be an awesome movie (I don't read comics)

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Cola1

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From: We will meet again as stars

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Re: Sexism in Comics

Not only is the anatomy of the girl on the left horribly inaccurate, but her body is skinner than a barbie doll.

It doesn't need to be perfect.

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0176

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From: Brazil

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Re: Sexism in Comics

One word: fanservice.

mrjawapa

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From: Ohio, USA

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Re: Sexism in Comics

Not only is the anatomy of the girl on the left horribly inaccurate, but her body is skinner than a barbie doll.

It doesn't need to be perfect.

Yeah I kinda like the cartoon girl.... don't get me wrong the real girl is moderately pretty but drawing a comic like that looks horrible

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Different55

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Joined: 2015-02-07

Posts: 16,575

Re: Sexism in Comics

Not only is the anatomy of the girl on the left horribly inaccurate, but her body is skinner than a barbie doll.

It doesn't need to be perfect.

Its not a matter of perfection, its a matter of them purposefully twisting her shape like that.

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"Sometimes failing a leap of faith is better than inching forward"
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mrjawapa

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From: Ohio, USA

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Re: Sexism in Comics

Like I said before... they change changes he shape of women to catch the eye of people, mainly hormone crazed teenagers... Prime example is this post, their drawing caught your eye and now it is stuck in your head... mission accomplished

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Calicara

Guest

Re: Sexism in Comics

Comics aren't meant to be taken seriously in regards to aesthetics. I don't think the creators intend to create a statement describing the correlation between weight and appeal, but rather it just so happens to be their style and method of drawing.

Then why do male characters look bulkier than female characters? Ignoring the obvious, men are just generally larger than woman, if their can be men who look anatomically accurate then why can't woman? Besides, it just seems to me that a big company like DC would want their characters to be somewhat anatomically accurate. Mary Jane isn't just standardized skinny in this picture, it's like they took out all her ribs and spine just for the sake of looking skinny. Kind of reminds me of Kingdom Hearts characters TBH...

1) Marvel over DC... any day.
2) Most older comic books you see are going to show girls as being very skinny and beautiful. But lets face it Spider-man trying to save a 450lb girl is not going to make a good story.
3)The girl in the comic book picture is meant to catch the eye of 12 year old testosterone loaded boys. who are willing to bang a toaster.

2) Lol, there is a difference between fat and obese. Even I would agree there should be a weight limit for people if only due to health reasons. Nevertheless, Mary Jane could have been a realistic 170-180 pounds and still look beautiful. She could have been 200 pounds and still look beautiful. However, making her an unobtainable shape and weight is making an image of beauty which is unobtainable. This can be harmful for girls and boys. As I have said above, if these are the type of characters children idolize then they are in some sense wanting to be like them. (Continued in next point V)

3) You're probably right, but that doesn't make it any less harmful. I'm not a huge fan of super hero comics, though I've watched the DC/Marvel movies in the theater. The message I usually get is that heroism and self-sacrifice is good, and evil is bad. The heroes, for the most part, always have a love interest. The love interest, though I think is slowly changing, tends to be the skinny long haired damsel in distress type. So lets say you are a female and you enjoy Spiderman, and since you really like Spiderman you ultimately want to base some of morals or ideals off of what you have read in this book. After all is it not the job of a comic to idealize heroism and goodness? If Mary Jane represent goodness and beauty, then she is being used as an example or role model of how beautiful woman should look in the universe of Spiderman.
When this same idea is used in other comics though, it's eventually carried over into the real world. If beautiful woman in these comics are white, skinny, and have long hair, so too must woman in the real world. That's an ok idealization of beauty, but people tend to forget it's not the only idealization of beautiful. Though perhaps I am speculating based on bias on the past I had faced for not fitting into the mythical norm for woman, and I still don't, I just think comic book industries should try harder to idolize different types of woman and not just the same overused sexist skinny model, so people know they're is more to beauty than body shape.

Last edited by Calicara (May 5 2014 9:35:33 am)

treejoe4

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Re: Sexism in Comics

why do you care failgirl, i thought only things that personally effect you should be talked about

mrjawapa

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From: Ohio, USA

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Re: Sexism in Comics

Men are usually bulkier because they are super-heroes. It makes them look strong and healthy. Idk anyone that would want a girl who has 5 mile wide hips, DDD breasts and a stomach that is the same size as my forearm. Guys are attracted to a woman's hips and breasts so they put massive emphasis on them to attract young boys who like I said are hormone crazed and willing to bang a toaster.

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Fdoou

Banned

Re: Sexism in Comics

so what you are saying is that a random number generator should decide the characteristics of the woman that way it's fairrrr?

Bimps

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Joined: 2015-02-08

Posts: 5,067

Re: Sexism in Comics

One word: fanservice.

you told me you were a troper, this proves it. but yeah this is pure fanservice, i bet inside the girl looks nothing like this

mrjawapa

Corn Man 🌽

From: Ohio, USA

Joined: 2015-02-15

Posts: 5,840

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Re: Sexism in Comics

so what you are saying is that a random number generator should decide the characteristics of the woman that way it's fairrrr?

No one said that...

However if you were do that there is one tinyurl.com/l5zvr8k. Could be useful.

Last edited by JaWapa (May 5 2014 1:58:44 pm)

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Muftwin

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Re: Sexism in Comics

why do you care failgirl, i thought only things that personally effect you should be talked about

its bcuz shes the girl on the left :O

Calicara

Guest

Re: Sexism in Comics

Men are usually bulkier because they are super-heroes. It makes them look strong and healthy. Idk anyone that would want a girl who has 5 mile wide hips, DDD breasts and a stomach that is the same size as my forearm. Guys are attracted to a woman's hips and breasts so they put massive emphasis on them to attract young boys who like I said are hormone crazed and willing to bang a toaster.

I realize what you are saying, and I have already said you are probably right, but I don't that makes it ok. The end doesn't justify the means. Companies that make fan po rn are just copping out of real art for money and that **** me off. Not only is it a bad role model for girls, but non quality art gets pushed and sold only because of the company name. If this artwork was made by some independent artist that no one heard of, there would be criticism for it's poor quality. However because it's Marvel and because its Spiderman people are going to buy it regardless of the quality. That's a whole different argument though. My point is that regardless of the reason they did this, it's a bad role model for the idealization of woman. I don't think woman should be morbidly obese in comics, but I don't think they should be anorexic skinny either. If comics want to idealize a woman they should do it in a realistic way, otherwise it's just sexist BS.
Here's an example of what comic characters would look if the men were drawn like woman.

why do you care failgirl, i thought only things that personally effect you should be talked about

People shouldn't judge others by their appearance because appearances can be deceiving. Likewise, it's not fair to force young girls into thinking that only being skinny with long hair is beautiful. Beauty is man made, and only makes a difference insofar as people continue to judge each other by the way they look. If we teach people to be accepting and appreciative of people for who they really are though, and not force them to abide by a mythical norm, the world would be a much happier place.

Last edited by Calicara (May 5 2014 3:34:49 pm)

treejoe4

Guest

Re: Sexism in Comics

failgirl, you said before you didn't really care what goes on besides what personally effects you, why did you say that then talk about this

and why would you even go to comics to see this kind of 'sexism', comics mainly have a male audience, their female influence doesn't reach that far, nor or many comic readers stupid enough to think that way

if you want to target sexism at it's heart, then go argue about the area of society obsessed with celebrities and how they look

Calicara

Guest

Re: Sexism in Comics

failgirl, you said before you didn't really care what goes on besides what personally effects you, why did you say that then talk about this

and why would you even go to comics to see this kind of 'sexism', comics mainly have a male audience, their female influence doesn't reach that far, nor or many comic readers stupid enough to think that way

if you want to target sexism at it's heart, then go argue about the area of society obsessed with celebrities and how they look

Because I am an artist, and one day hope go into the graphic novel industry. It isn't just comics though, it's cartoons, video games, and anime as well. Though females may be the minority of the audience, that doesn't mean they should be ignored completely. When I write my first graphic novel you can bet I will have both strong female and male characters. Comics shouldn't be made into cheap po rn, that is an insult to story tellers everywhere. I'm not ignorant to fact of how prevalent the art of story telling is abused to make money, but life isn't about money to me. Stories that are made to sell are usually cheap crappy pulp fiction that shouldn't be on the market to begin with, yet it is because of that same nature than they make so many sales.
I have often said to myself, though my work may not be popular, and though others may not like me, I'd rather write a well thought graphic novel with sub-par drawings, than to make a fabulously drawn sexist por no just to seduce men into wasting their money. Consciously knowing you are drawing only for money is no better than a mercenary at war. People should get paid for drawing quality work, not sexist pulp.
P.S. I think celebrities can be sexist too, but this topic is about comics not celebrities.

Last edited by Calicara (May 5 2014 4:26:12 pm)

Fdoou

Banned

Re: Sexism in Comics

i don't know, it's a lot of sexism about this in real life too. once girls got to that age, there became a few groups that were constantly talking about g :O y things and obsessing over them, labeling male characters from media as "top" and "bottom", and things that made me sad that I couldn't talk about in big open spaces.

HEY FAILGIRL I HAVE SOMETHING INTELLIGENT TO SAY   and it's that you should look at the hidden object games for female characters done right! Since gameplay of those games is enough to make almost anyone but some types of moms sad, most of the stories are mother daughter ones and not world-boobs ones. i saw this in a video

Last edited by Fdoou (May 5 2014 5:31:51 pm)

mrjawapa

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From: Ohio, USA

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Re: Sexism in Comics

@Failgirl LMFAO! If I went and got a caricature of myself it would be kind of the same thing... It's unrealistic, but it catches your eye... I think the comic girl is pretty, is that weird? I guess the biggest impact on how this is viewed is gender.

@treejoe4 She sees this as going towards her because she is a female. I see where she is coming from on this. She sees this as impacting how men view women. She saying it portrays them as models and men become known to this and look down on women who are not how they look in comics because it is an unrealistic image.

@Fido what?

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treejoe4

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Re: Sexism in Comics

@Failgirl LMFAO! If I went and got a caricature of myself it would be kind of the same thing... It's unrealistic, but it catches your eye... I think the comic girl is pretty, is that weird? I guess the biggest impact on how this is viewed is gender.

@treejoe4 She sees this as going towards her because she is a female. I see where she is coming from on this. She sees this as impacting how men view women. She saying it portrays them as models and men become known to this and look down on women who are not how they look in comics because it is an unrealistic image.

@Fido what?

duhh you think so?

Don't patronize me
Quite frankly why should anyone even listen to failgirl's minor opinion on 'sexism', because last time i checked it was
1.art
2.just something that bothers failgirl, but she doesn't care about anything else, so why should she be listened too

Guys will and will always favor particular features of the female anatomy, so they will highlight them in unrealistic and 'erotic' cartoon form. Nobody with a rational mind thinks they are realistic, nor will judge someone because they don't look like a cartoon.

Nobody cares what you think Failgirl, nobody is stopping you drawing some god like male figure. And quite quite frankly I find that the way males are drawn in comics also creates unrealistic goals for males too, your failure to get angered by this is just another example of feminism's toxic, irrational, sewage like opinions spilling into every aspect of society.

And lastly limiting what people draw because people think it's 'sexist' is censorship, art is an expression of opinion and emotion, the only time that needs limiting is if you want to establish a 40ft giant **** statue in the middle of a city.

Fdoou

Banned

Re: Sexism in Comics

come on jawapa, i actually made an intelligent post

Calicara

Guest

Re: Sexism in Comics

@Treejoe4: If no one should care what I think then no one should care what you think either Treegoist4. Frankly, having unrealistic portrayals of woman is just as harmful as telling a girl she's ugly to her face because she doesn't fit into the the mythical norm. Men might be drawn unrealistic too, but nearly as much as woman. There is nothing wrong with standing up for female rights, ever hear of the glass ceiling? The glass ceiling is this theorized ceiling which prevents woman and minorities from reaching the upper ladders of society. When we, as people, portray our females as weak damsels in distress it's just gonna support the patriarchy of society which as been around since the dawn of time. Wake up and small the roses, in case you weren't aware inequality exists in the world. If woman want to be damsels that's their business, but there is no reason one body type should have a monopoly on societal norms.
BTW I do care about other people, I just don't care about you. Unless you have something intelligent to say please leave my topic alone. The last thing I want is another lock because you don't know when to quit. If you don't care about what I say, then you have no reason to post here.

Last edited by Calicara (May 5 2014 6:59:16 pm)

mrjawapa

Corn Man 🌽

From: Ohio, USA

Joined: 2015-02-15

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Re: Sexism in Comics

@treejoe4 She has the freedom of speech and she has the right to post what she so pleases to on here as long as it fallows the rules. And because she likes to debate things, and this is a perfect topic to debate on...

@Fido Ik I wasn't expecting it and so it went right over my head lol

@failgirl just ignore his posts, nearly everything I see him post is B.S. anyway...

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