The Moderation of EE Part II

skullz17 · 2016-09-18 15:24:58

Master1, even if you have explained your little short term mistakes (which should be one-offs), Zoey's concern seems to be a little more long term. I'm not sure if it has been solved yet, but could you address that?

hummerz5, Xfrogman43, Emma333

SmittyW · 2016-09-18 15:37:37

skullz17 wrote:

Master1, even if you have explained your little short term mistakes (which should be one-offs), Zoey's concern seems to be a little more long term. I'm not sure if it has been solved yet, but could you address that?

Did you even read the final notes? Do you expect him to show you the future?

hummerz5 · 2016-09-18 15:52:33

SmittyW wrote:

Did you even read the final notes? Do you expect him to show you the future?

My interpretation is the request for an acknowledgement of potentially repeated acts that happened in the long term in the past. No future-prediction necessary. I was wondering the same; we don't need some terribly extensive summary of his moderation, but it would be nice to see that get addressed.

Processor · 2016-09-18 16:39:14

dylantherabbit wrote:

Also, telling someone to kys is a reason for a permaban? Really? It's just an acronym mostly teenagers throw around. Even if he says 'kill yourself', it's still an acronym mostly teens throw around.

Master1 didn't permaban ninja.

It was me actually, and it was because of all the wrong things ninja has done during the past months, not just these two instances (fig. 3 and fig. 5).

Master1 wrote:

I Was afk at the time this happened, A ban was issued to ninja after I checked a report on it. Another ban was issued as soon as that one expired (being permanent) No issues here.

There IS an issue here. The issue is that it was me who permabanned him, not you. I had to step in after seeing that you were failing to properly punish ninja.

MartenM, Zoey2070, Xfrogman43

TaskManager · 2016-09-18 16:56:57

even if master1 admits his mistakes, i still think this has to be done

Zoey2070 wrote:

on August 25th, Nou warned Master1 that if he made another misstep, he would be demodded.

Zoey2070, Emma333

Zoey2070 · 2016-09-18 17:00:22

Master1 wrote:

I can honestly say that I've learned a lot from this topic, and plan to change my style of moderation accordingly.

Yes, okay. Nou warned you three weeks ago to be a better mod or else you'd be demodded, there was that topic five months back, but you've only just now realized you're an awful mod. You've admitted to three mistakes, two of which occurred in the last week AFTER you were warned by Nou. But of course, you're just now willing to make a legitimate effort to improve. You definitely have a great track record. You've only been a mod for nearly two years, it's okay for you to make so many mistakes. Oh, wait, no it isn't. This topic is because Nou said "hey get better or get demodded" and you clearly haven't gotten better so there's only one option left.

I'd still kind of like to know what you think of the admittedly incredibly old conversation between you and insanity, where he was banned and on an alt in your world, after a conversation where I asked you if he was banned and if you'd ban the alt, which I don't have screenshots of because, as Koya said, I naively expected something to be done. My bad for trusting in the moderation for even the simplest things including obvious rulebreaking I guess.

dude so like i told zoey if u evaded your ban i'd ban you again
but
i want you to **** help
i already told her u were banned
i set the world to vis false so you can stay hidden

(this is in the spoiler in the OP by the way)
x

Master1 wrote:

Another ban was issued as soon as that one expired (being permanent) No issues here.

So there's no issues here because he was permabanned by Processor? So you're saying that the best way to have "no issues" is to have other people -- people whose primary job isn't even to moderate -- do your work for you.

Xfrogman43, Emma333, Akatsuk1

Zumza · 2016-09-18 17:14:22

This isn't the first time when were talking about demoding somebody.
But I see that a lot of people miss the point. It is not just the fault of the person in cause. Its also about who nominated him.

Xfrogman43 · 2016-09-18 17:17:52

Zumza wrote:

This isn't the first time when were talking about demoding somebody.
But I see that a lot of people miss the point. It is not just the fault of the person in cause. Its also about who nominated him.

Pretty sure most people saw him as being a good moderator as he was player, that just didn't turn out to be.

Muftwin · 2016-09-18 17:22:06

Zoey please, is this really what you want seriously. It was ninja that tried this on you not m1...

Yes there is a such thing as a private world you are friends with a lot of us so you can totally get in to our private worlds. All of those worlds were private. Ysee the thing you miss is that you want to ban the few people that play this game nearly every single day. As you know this game is "dead" as we call it, so i would think those of us that are left would be considered valuable. I for one absolutely agree that ninja is a toxic player, but he still shows up to hang out with us all the time and is in our group "mirin squad", and i wouldnt want him banned for that reason. I can see chat banning him again he was chat banned for a while, but thats fine because we can friend him and those of us who know him and arent babys and dont get offended like that can put up with him, and he cant attack random people any more.

I would say most people on the forums dont play the game and dont realise this either. We talk about people that are "surveilance cameras" (those who post every word we say on the forums and try to make us look bad), and thats exactly what these people see. I dont know how we still trust you zoey I really dont. If you think master1 is a problem your really messed up.

Edit: you probly wont respond. I want you to respond. I simply want to know what you stand to gain from trying to take us down like you are. you are causing drama you are a toxin too maybe theres a reason we wanted you demodded that obviously different cant see.

Hostage, Hannah32

SmittyW · 2016-09-18 17:37:18

Has anyone actually reported insanity and gang? I know it sounds dumb but I'm not there to witness it. Did someone who legitimately felt harassed by them that were not zoe or n1kf report him? Because if there's report files that m1 is ignoring then that's serious but if no one else is complaining and you're following them in private worlds just to point out flaws then that's wrong. I want to know if it's the same 2-3 people ragging on them or others feel this way.

Muftwin, Slabdrill, hummerz5, Schlog, Hannah32, Akatsuk1

Gosha · 2016-09-18 17:43:55

When i see drama on forums

MartenM, SirJosh3917

Processor · 2016-09-18 17:56:12

Muftwin wrote:

As you know this game is "dead" as we call it, so i would think those of us that are left would be considered valuable.

We have a category of rules to protect users from other users. We have these rules to protect our valuable users from harassment and make sure they have a fun time playing EE.
In the screenshots zoey provided exactly these rules were broken. (telling someone to kill themselves, slit their throat, called an inbred ****, etc.)

Let's agree that as long as you don't hurt anyone else's feelings, you shouldn't be banned by these rules.

So the theory goes like this: "as long as you flame others in a private world it's fine because it is a private world."

Were those worlds "private" if we are seeing screenshots of them in here? Did it matter that the worlds were visible false when we have people in the these worlds reporting each other? Aren't the rules protecting our valuable players from each other broken if there are people reporting harassment?

Muftwin wrote:

We talk about people that are "surveilance cameras" (those who post every word we say on the forums and try to make us look bad), and thats exactly what these people see.

You can't dictate what zoey can or cannot do. She has every right to join a world if she knows the ID of it or sees a link to it, and if she is harassed because of joining a world, it isn't her fault.

That's like blaming someone for getting raped because they talked to the wrong person.

Muftwin wrote:

I for one absolutely agree that ninja is a toxic player, but he still shows up to hang out with us all the time and is in our group "mirin squad", and i wouldnt want him banned for that reason.

I guess it is unfortunate that Master1's friends also turn out to be the most toxic players in EE, but a moderator should put his friends aside when it comes to moderation, and treat everyone equally.

Oh and muftwin, you are essentially saying that you are ok with letting other players be harassed by your friend because he is your friend. I believe that this issue of master1 favoring his friends is the reason we are having this discussion right now. It always seems to be his friends who are unfairly treated, isn't it?

Akatsuk1

Bimps · 2016-09-18 18:06:12

Master1 wrote:

Alright I guess it's about time to make a post on this.
I would first like to start off by apologizing for a few things:
-
Fig. 3 Here, you can see me being insulted -- “your existence is trash” and “you inbred ****”-- to which Master1 replied, “wtf Ninja” but didn’t even really reprimand Ninja beyond that.
In this picture, I made an honest mistake. Essentially it was all a misread, mostly caused by N1KF's statement throwing me off. It lead me to think that Ninja had flamed me, which I could really care less about. Had I realized at that time that it was meant for zoey, I would have banned him.
Fig. 4 In this chatlog, Master1 practically promotes lewd behavior and doesn’t do anything about it which encourages these types of comments.
I agree with what was written, and I should have been more careful.
Fig. 6 So here you can see both mods refusing to moderate even completely unacceptable actions, telling people things like this are allowed in “private” worlds, and then joking about sexually explicit worlds being okay.
Once again, I completely agree. Something should have been done about this. At the time when I first learned about it (through a PM from benje00) it seemed that he had already handled it, which is why I simply ignored it. I guess it turns out that nobody was ever punished for it. Again, I will be try and be more careful from now on.
As for the other images, I would just like to explain what exactly was going on in each situation, and why I disagree with them.
Fig. 1 "Master1 refuses to do moderation because he believes it doesn’t actually work. Why is he a mod?"
Going to *try* to keep this one short, basically this was all hugely misunderstood. The chat was taken completely out of context. It looks as if I'm saying moderating as a whole is dumb. This is not what I meant at all. I was basically explaining to N1KF that some people will constantly return on new accounts to break rules again and again, pointing out that it doesn't ALWAYS work, that sometimes you need to ignore players and let them tire themselves out and get bored of whatever it is that they're doing. After all, most people that end up banned are doing it for the attention anyways. So the point I was making basically was - Giving people the attention they crave isn't always the correct solution. (Did not succeed in making that short rip)
Fig 2. When playing EE, he refuses to moderate even if he is there while players are being told to kill themselves.
First off, the picture doesn't really accurately match the text at all. I was actually confused by this one for quite a while - I can however assure you that I do moderate when players are being told to kill themselves, just like any other harassment related issue. I'd also like to take a chance to discuss what was actually shown in the picture here. In my opinion, it makes the most sense to do all of the work at once, either before I come online or after I get off. Yes I will sometimes let little things slide even if I'm present, I will also occasionally miss bigger issues, due to simply getting too involved with playing the game and not really paying attention to chat. If something gets "too" out of hand and I notice it, I will act. Most of the smaller things I find it's best to wait and see if a report is sent, and then deal with it then.
Fig 5. Ninja has broken the rules multiple times in the past; this is not even the first time he’s told people to kill themselves. Ninja was banned only 2 days for telling someone to kill themselves. That clearly doesn’t teach Ninja anything because it’s such a short amount of time.
I Was afk at the time this happened, A ban was issued to ninja after I checked a report on it. Another ban was issued as soon as that one expired (being permanent) No issues here.
Final notes:
Yes, I will agree with you all that I am not a great mod, I'll even go a step further and say that I'm pretty far from it. But as always, nobody is ever perfect. Mistakes are going to be made, and the best we can hope for is to learn from them. I can honestly say that I've learned a lot from this topic, and plan to change my style of moderation accordingly.
I would also like to add that I'm going to attempt to get chatbans added to the game, I feel the small limit on punishment options (really only 1) has heavily influenced how I deal with certain situations. Most of the time I find that a ban is too extreme, while doing nothing isn't quite enough. A chatban could easily be that inbetween punishment that would fix most of my issues.
In closing, if anyone has anything else they'd like to discuss with me, feel free to send me a PM. I'd much rather have several one-on-one PM conversations where I can explain issues in detail, than have unexplained posts sitting here where anyone can read them and just assume one side of the story.
Thanks for taking your time to read/skim through this.

dude ive literally seen you call n1kf autistic

MartenM · 2016-09-18 18:08:38

Bimps wrote:

dude ive literally seen you call n1kf autistic

Don't know much about the discussion, but if that's true. In that case my opinion is to demod master1.
Mods should never harass someone.

Btw are we getting any EU mods? Because I only see mods in the evening when I play (like 01:00).

Muftwin · 2016-09-18 18:09:43

and if she is harassed because of joining a world, it isn't her fault.

Thats exactly the problem she isnt being harassed someone who doesnt care is, and shes taking offense for them. We dont care. We dont care.

you are essentially saying that you are ok with letting other players be harassed by your friend because he is your friend

I dont know where you get this from

Zumza · 2016-09-18 18:12:26

Processor wrote:

I guess it is unfortunate that Master1's friends also turn out to be the most toxic players in EE

Lets just stop flaming people ok?

Processor · 2016-09-18 18:14:45

Muftwin wrote:

you are essentially saying that you are ok with letting other players be harassed by your friend because he is your friend
I dont know where you get this from

From here:

Muftwin wrote:

I for one absolutely agree that ninja is a toxic player, but he still shows up to hang out with us all the time and is in our group "mirin squad", and i wouldnt want him banned for that reason.

"ninja is toxic [because he flames other players and makes them uncomfortable] but since he is in my crew, I wouldn't want him banned"

Zoey2070 · 2016-09-18 18:15:20

Muftwin wrote:

Zoey please, is this really what you want seriously. It was ninja that tried this on you not m1...
Yes there is a such thing as a private world you are friends with a lot of us so you can totally get in to our private worlds. All of those worlds were private. Ysee the thing you miss is that you want to ban the few people that play this game nearly every single day. As you know this game is "dead" as we call it, so i would think those of us that are left would be considered valuable. I for one absolutely agree that ninja is a toxic player, but he still shows up to hang out with us all the time and is in our group "mirin squad", and i wouldnt want him banned for that reason. I can see chat banning him again he was chat banned for a while, but thats fine because we can friend him and those of us who know him and arent babys and dont get offended like that can put up with him, and he cant attack random people any more.
I would say most people on the forums dont play the game and dont realise this either. We talk about people that are "surveilance cameras" (those who post every word we say on the forums and try to make us look bad), and thats exactly what these people see. I dont know how we still trust you zoey I really dont. If you think master1 is a problem your really messed up.
Edit: you probly wont respond. you probly think im volitile. i probly am. I want you to respond. I simply want to know what you stand to gain from trying to take us down like you are.

This isn't about the feud you guys think we have. This has nothing to do with my personal feelings about any of the Mirin Squad, this is about Nou saying Master1 gets one more chance and Master1 not shaping up. I have said absolutely nothing about wanting anyone banned, this isn't about removing anyone from the game. This is about removing Master1 as a moderator. There are 3 thousand people who play the game daily; a lot more than the seven-ish people who are part of Mirin Squad. You're no more valuable than anyone else.

How am I trying to make you look bad when this is exactly what you say? I'm not manipulating information or photoshopping any chatlogs.

"If you think master1 is a problem your really messed up."

appalling grammar aside, Master1's an okay guy. He's a bad moderator and this has been proven time and time again. This isn't about Mirin Squad's members other than that they break the rules and nothing is done about it. This is about what Nou said and what Nou hasn't done yet.

I'm not trying to "take [you] down" by getting Master1 demodded, unless you believe the only thing keeping your crew together is having a mod on your side, in which case, proves my point that he's a bad mod.

Akatsuk1

Bimps · 2016-09-18 18:16:37

everyone knows m1 is a **** mod whether they like him or not so can he just be demodded

Muftwin · 2016-09-18 18:24:21

Processor wrote:

"ninja is toxic [because he flames other players and makes them uncomfortable] but since he is in my crew, I wouldn't want him banned"

you missed the part right after where i said "however he could be chat banned so he can only flame my crew members" which solves the problem your having with him, but doesnt take him away from us.

Zoey wrote:

How am I trying to make you look bad when this is exactly what you say? I'm not manipulating information or photoshopping any chatlogs.

as master1 said earlier back all of these quotes are out of context. Out of context is totally manipulative whether or not its intentional. heck see above processor just did exactly that

Zoey wrote:

I'm not trying to "take [you] down" by getting Master1 demodded, unless you believe the only thing keeping your crew together is having a mod on your side, in which case, proves my point that he's a bad mod.

Its a slippery slope. Once you get rid of master1 theres nothing stopping you from saying the rest of mirin squad is toxic and should be banned which your pretty much already saying.

Zoey wrote:

There are 3 thousand people who play the game daily; a lot more than the seven-ish people who are part of Mirin Squad. You're no more valuable than anyone else.

i actually disagree with this too we are the only people who make high quality content for the game. Dont try to argue 100 box minigames is same quality as what we make. No good content in the game means no new players will join.

you still didnt answer what you personally gain from master1 not being a mod

Schlog · 2016-09-18 18:27:20

proc why didn't you just chatban me

Muftwin

Abelysk · 2016-09-18 21:37:29

Processor wrote:

I guess it is unfortunate that Master1's friends also turn out to be the most toxic players in EE, but a moderator should put his friends aside when it comes to moderation, and treat everyone equally.

I'm not toxic

He really only has like 2 people who are super toxic but that's it.

N1KF · 2016-09-18 22:08:06

Bimps wrote:

dude ive literally seen you call n1kf autistic

If that's true, then letting it get public isn't that much better than telling me directly. I think allowing a negative atmosphere be spread around the game due to a moderator should be discouraged. Master1 himself has admitted that he knows that Ninja won't get better. While he did get banned by Processor, the ban wasn't because of Master1, so I think that should be a reason for concern.

Minimania · 2016-09-19 00:21:05

dylantherabbit wrote:

Also, telling someone to kys is a reason for a permaban? Really? It's just an acronym mostly teenagers throw around. Even if he says 'kill yourself', it's still an acronym mostly teens throw around.

You don't really deserve a response here, but suicide isn't a joke

N1KF, Yandax

Schlog · 2016-09-19 00:33:58

minimania wrote:

dylantherabbit wrote:
Also, telling someone to kys is a reason for a permaban? Really? It's just an acronym mostly teenagers throw around. Even if he says 'kill yourself', it's still an acronym mostly teens throw around.
You don't really deserve a response here, but suicide isn't a joke

no i tell the other person an incredibly violent method that they should use to commit suicide
i don't use "kys"

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#26 2016-09-18 15:24:58

Re: The Moderation of EE Part II

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