should troll be reportwhrotly in EE?

ASDruska · 2020-03-24 15:38:17

i think that trolling should be a reportable offence in ee and should be punished by being unable to input the code for a period of time (but being able to get edit from owner)
now the question is, is the moderation team able to handle reports of some guy who just happened to place a lot of blocks in a chaotic and sometimes destructive way

capasha · 2020-03-24 16:05:22

peace wrote:

capasha wrote:
peace wrote:
2b what fi tis free edit? and what if ur afk?
0) Make a crew
1) Add your friends
2) Give them kick or edit access
3) ????
4) PROFIT
why woudld oyu wste a free edit world to a crew in my eyes people shouldnt get away wiht rolling by simply a kick of the owner i was in a free edit worl donce when a guy got kicked for torll came back 5 minutes later (ban time of kick) and starte dtrolling again

Serious, trolling will never be against the rules. Stop make code to edit or edit worlds. It's your own fault if you give people you know nothing about edit.
You should be able to control your own world, the reason I said crew would help you. If not use crew then just stop this madness.

rat, 2b55b5g, ShadowsEdge

peace · 2020-03-24 16:21:59

maby you shoudl be able to ban peopel form editign in your worlds by /banedit wiht an reason rpovided an the enxt time oyu want to give th euser edit you get a warnign do you really want to give this user edit you have blacckliste dhim for th efollowing reason: XXXXXX

if the user tires to input code it wont work because he got blacklisted you can alsways /unabnedit an user

Luka504 · 2020-03-24 16:31:26

Oh, I did do some reflection after your first post, Skullz, and my answer is still the same; no one should be entertaining peace's suggestion. Most people here have their belief set that trolling shouldn't be report-worthy and I genuinely doubt peace of all people's going to convince them otherwise. We already know the answer; anti-trolling rules can't possibly be enforced and there's nothing to discuss regarding that.

If you want to discuss things like permanent owner bans, which actually have the potential for an actual discussion, that's a different story. How about people talk about things like that instead of replying to peace's fourth "I don't know how to manage my free edit world so I need a report button" post?

As for the toxicity, so what? You perceive me as toxic for telling people to ignore peace's idea just as much as I perceive you as a white knight for defending him. What you think of me or what I think of you is trivial.

2b55b5g · 2020-03-24 16:39:10

peace wrote:

maby you shoudl be able to ban peopel form editign in your worlds by /banedit wiht an reason rpovided an the enxt time oyu want to give th euser edit you get a warnign do you really want to give this user edit you have blacckliste dhim for th efollowing reason: XXXXXX
if the user tires to input code it wont work because he got blacklisted you can alsways /unabnedit an user

yea this is good

it's still kinda the owner's fault if someone trolls tho. if it's a normal world then never give strangers edit. if it's a free edit, then don't give the troller edit the second time. if you knew he trolls and you STILL gave him edit, then it's totally your fault.

XxAtillaxX · 2020-03-24 16:41:34

peace is trolling the forums, should that be report worthy? i vote yes

ASDruska, capasha

Andymakeer · 2020-03-24 16:53:39

OP:
well i think its not report-worthy, but you should stay alert to trolling behaviour.

Luka related:
No one is forcing you to discuss this.
So if you dont want to, just leave.

If there is a consensus whether the topic is not worthy discussion, then it will inevitably sink as there will be no replies.
Replying to a topic you think its not worthy just pulls it up to the top and highlight notifications, granting the topic the attention you wanted to avoid.

Tomahawk · 2020-03-24 16:57:14

Luka504 wrote:

no one should be entertaining peace's suggestion

This subforum is for debate. Announcing that this is not a discussion worth having is unconstructive and narrow-minded.

Arguing whether the Earth is flat is not an analogy for this thread. There is no "objective" answer, and no matter how strong your opinion is, it is worthless if you don't actually argue. Avoid posting your opinion if you're not willing to justify and defend it.

Luka504 wrote:

As for the toxicity, so what?

We've pretty much stopped with the Off-Topic warning, but it can be applied for users who are disruptive and annoying.

peace, Andymakeer

Luka504 · 2020-03-24 17:20:13

Tomahawk wrote:

There is no "objective" answer

There's no feasible way for trolling to be reportable/moderated just as there's no feasible way for the Earth to be flat. There's genuinely no point in discussing it like it's some sort of contentious point, which is why I told people to simply not bother. Talk about something where there's actual room for debate instead of entertaining peace's wild idea.

Tomahawk wrote:

We've pretty much stopped with the Off-Topic warning, but it can be applied for users who are disruptive and annoying.

So, essentially nothing. Oh sure, I may get warned, but the discussion is still the same, regardless of whether I'm toxic or not.

Tomahawk · 2020-03-24 17:31:34

Ignoring Luka's inability to reason, let's continue this debate from the other side:

If players were able to open a free edit world without fear of vandalism, we'd get more of the kind of collaborative creativity that Benjaminsen presumably intended when he designed EE.

I think the core aim has merit. The majority of players don't like trolls, and trolling is a net negative behaviour. Eliminating it would therefore have a positive outcome.

Enforcing it would ofc be difficult but definitely not impossible. You could write programs to detect some types of trolling, or record all block-placement for moderators to review a small fraction of cases, or add a votekick and "voteundo" for players to revert trolling, as well as /ban for world owners to punish trollers. It would be much easier to reduce trolling in EEU than EE, since each EEU player atm has effectively paid for their account and therefore receives real punishment if they're temp- or permabanned.

You don't need to catch all trolling to eradicate it; you just need to make an example of enough people that the rest fall into line. It would require a large initial effort, then constant upkeep, but even something as simple as an announcement banning trolling would start the change.

peace, N1KF

XxAtillaxX · 2020-03-24 18:00:16

Tomahawk wrote:

If players were able to open a free edit world without fear of vandalism, we'd get more of the kind of collaborative creativity that Benjaminsen presumably intended when he designed EE.

It's entirely possible to do that already with bots, and it has been tried multiple times in the past. It turns out that it doesn't attract "collaborative creativity" presumably because people can already collaborate without fear of reprisal via crews and the like.

Tomahawk wrote:

I think the core aim has merit. The majority of players don't like trolls, and trolling is a net negative behaviour. Eliminating it would therefore have a positive outcome.

The majority of people don't like adulterers however the majority of people are against imprisoning them despite the net negative behaviour.

Luka504 · 2020-03-24 18:09:28

Tomahawk wrote:

Ignoring Luka's inability to reason, let's continue this debate from the other side:

Wow, not only do you put me down, but you also get to keep up the persona you're this really intelligent and cool dude. I'm honestly just waiting for you to bust through the wall any second now and preach about logical fallacies like they're the second coming.

Tomahawk wrote:

You could write programs to detect some types of trolling, or record all block-placement for moderators to review a small fraction of cases

Jeez, this really reminds me of how flat-earthers retort the concept of meteor showers by saying "well, if we assume that space agencies could've made fireworks look like meteor showers, then you can't deny flat Earth is totally possible!"

Yes, we can technically do all of the things you suggested, but they're so nonsensical and silly there's genuinely no point. Designing a bot to automatically kick trolls which isn't total garbage is difficult and a waste of so much developer time. Assigning moderators to the task of dealing with trolls is yet another waste of time that could be spent dealing with actual problems.

Stop creating convoluted solutions to fix peace's bad suggestion.

Tomahawk wrote:

or add a votekick and "voteundo" for players to revert trolling, as well as /ban for world owners to punish trollers. It would be much easier to reduce trolling in EEU than EE, since each EEU player atm has effectively paid for their account and therefore receives real punishment if they're temp- or permabanned.

This, however, is better. This seems far more feasible and realistic while not taking away too much time. This is the sort of **** I wanted to be discussed.

XxAtillaxX

TaskManager · 2020-03-24 18:14:17

Tomahawk wrote:

even something as simple as an announcement banning trolling would start the change.

I can bet all my gems on the change being in opposite direction from the one that is anticipated

P.S: Votekick may be a fair solution but voteundo is just not possible to implement efficiently imo

Luka504

ASDruska · 2020-03-24 19:31:41

let's ignore this thread because its peace!
wtf you're ignoring me because im lukas04? you must be a friggin egotist man!

aaa how do i stay on topic. uhhh, votekick could be abused?

Luka504

Tomahawk · 2020-03-24 19:36:43

Luka504 wrote:

waste of so much developer time

Luka504 wrote:

another waste of time

Yeah, designing complex ways to smack trolls is not a priority right now with EE discontinued and EEU still in beta, but taking serious measures to deal with trolling could become worthwhile later, for instance in retaining new EEU players. Some measures may also be easier to implement if they're started now when EEU is easier to change, like serverside logging of in-world events.

I listed a few possibilities (which can't be dismissed with that little effort) but there are probably dozens. Here's another: players mark trollers, who can lose enough "trust factor" to not be able to edit in any open world with the corresponding "trust factor" restriction enabled.

XxAtillaxX wrote:

The majority of people don't like adulterers however the majority of people are against imprisoning them despite the net negative behaviour.

As the world’s most popular fruit, bananas account for roughly 75 percent of the tropical fruit trade and more than a hundred billion are eaten annually. I could connect this to the point I'm making but apparently it's obvious. ~Sarcastic quip aside, who's to say that a majority of people wouldn't want the players who trolled their work to get smacked?

peace

TaskManager · 2020-03-24 19:52:18

ASDruska wrote:

uhhh, votekick could be abused?

let world owner allow/disallow it

Tomahawk wrote:

players mark trollers, who can lose enough "trust factor" to not be able to edit in any open world with the corresponding "trust factor" restriction enabled.

hey, remember when we brought rep back on forums?

Luka504 · 2020-03-24 20:18:10

Tomahawk wrote:

Yeah, designing complex ways to smack trolls is not a priority right now with EE discontinued and EEU still in beta.

Wasted time is wasted time, regardless if we're speaking of EE, beta EEU or open EEU. The things we need to make anti-trolling rules enforceable are not worth maybe stopping some players from leaving the game. And I'd put that last bit under an asterisk since I'm skeptical it's going to save more players than it loses.

I'm certain a decent amount of people like trolling free edit worlds just for the heck of it. They'd get a kick out of, well, getting kicked, and in a game as mind-numbingly boring as EEU, getting banned for those little moments of chaotic joy could make them stop playing entirely.

peace · 2020-03-24 21:48:55

Luka504 wrote:

and in a game as mind-numbingly boring as EEU, getting banned for those little moments of chaotic joy could make them stop playing entirely.

yeah and 1 guy gets banned an dleaves and 5 other players start to enjoy the game even mor enow theres 1 torlle rless thats a net profit of 4 players so

capasha · 2020-03-24 21:51:54

TaskManager wrote:

ASDruska wrote:
uhhh, votekick could be abused?
let world owner allow/disallow it
Tomahawk wrote:
players mark trollers, who can lose enough "trust factor" to not be able to edit in any open world with the corresponding "trust factor" restriction enabled.
hey, remember when we brought rep back on forums?

I guess he wont remember. But if this get added, I would abuse it as much as I did it on the forums. So fun.

TaskManager · 2020-03-24 22:37:15

peace wrote:

yeah and 1 guy gets banned an d mkae s a ne w alt acocunt adn come sbcak

ftfy

skullz17 · 2020-03-25 01:01:17

Luka504 wrote:

If you want to discuss things like permanent owner bans, which actually have the potential for an actual discussion, that's a different story. How about people talk about things like that instead of replying to peace's fourth "I don't know how to manage my free edit world so I need a report button" post?

That's fine, I was under the impression that you were straight up telling people to stop posting in this topic because you thought that was a waste of time. If this^ is what you meant the first time then you weren't being as toxic as I thought, but you still didn't need to say it in such a rude way. It's not peace's fault what people are choosing to talk about so idk why you have to make your post about putting him down. And my response to you has nothing to do with white knighting peace, there's nothing I could possibly gain from that and I don't even think he cares about your post lol. I just thought you were being a **** person, so I called you out because I think you should try to be better, and this community should try to be better because holy **** it is so much more toxic than it used to be.

XxAtillaxX wrote:

The majority of people don't like adulterers however the majority of people are against imprisoning them despite the net negative behaviour.

Well I don't think getting banned for a day or two is all that severe of a punishment. Plus it makes sense for something like adultery to be outside of the scope of the law. But when you think of the rules in EE, things like harassment and bullying are not allowed, so it's not much of a stretch to imagine purposely causing grief by trolling being against the rules.

Luka504 wrote:

I'm certain a decent amount of people like trolling free edit worlds just for the heck of it. They'd get a kick out of, well, getting kicked, and in a game as mind-numbingly boring as EEU, getting banned for those little moments of chaotic joy could make them stop playing entirely.

The game doesn't have to accommodate these players though. The objective should be to just appeal to the intended audience really well, instead of trying to appeal to everyone.

2b55b5g · 2020-03-25 01:02:54

peace wrote:

Luka504 wrote:
and in a game as mind-numbingly boring as EEU, getting banned for those little moments of chaotic joy could make them stop playing entirely.
yeah and 1 guy gets banned an dleaves and 5 other players start to enjoy the game even mor enow theres 1 torlle rless thats a net profit of 4 players so

EE and EEU are meant to be SANDBOX games. Players can do whatever they want. If no trolling ever becomes a rule, then sure, ban the person who gave them edit instead. Who told the world owner to be dumb and give strangers edit? And what I see from your points is that you’re just simply putting all the blame on the trollers, but not on the world owner who decides to be a **** and give all people edit.
You wanna prevent trolling on free edit worlds? The answer is that most likely you can’t. Some people wanna ruin things (and tbh that’s one part of fun in the game), and I know that’s quite bad. Not ban-worthy though, you already suggested an editing blacklist, and I think that’s good enough, while the troller doesn’t troll, people can still have fun. We lose no players. I don’t get why people can be banned for trolling. There are way more worse things such as harassing people, spamming the chat, sending threats and more. What trolling does is just ruining a world, and even if it’s ruined, you still have the /loadlevel command, it’s not really that big of an issue.

I hope banning because of trolling doesn’t happen. But if it ever happens, I think the max penalty should be 30 minutes. It’s a short amount of time, and I think it’s enough for people to rethink their actions.

peace · 2020-03-25 11:36:32

i little agree that maby bannign isnt worth the torll but it sitll shouldnt be allowed even in aan sandbox game a troller can have fnun but ruin 6 people's day because theweir art got vanished in the trolls while the owner went to take a shower loading the level will remvoe a few arts that werent saved the torller get skciked and may be comming back and there is quite osme free eidt worlds which use the code so the owner doesnt have to give edit this essentially allows everyoen to have fun but trollers hwo get kciked come back 5 min later to do the same mischief again so that last part should be stopped maby an special kick that wne the reason is trolling the person cant edit for a period of time period would be longer base don how bbad person is an dhow many times he get sthis special kcik an din hwo short period (person can edit in his own world fine though) person wiht the edit disbaled cant use the code feature but can still reachive edit in some cases but everyone will be warmnned abotu his mishief when he issitll in the editban after his time runs out his username and all is normal (give him a 2nd chance lol) ultimatily someone coudl in rare cases get an permanent editban if they dont give a **** extra warnigns will be given before you give edit and the code function never works for them nor can bots auto edit them (so he doens tjoin an freedit world which has a bto whihc auto says /gedit X) for EEU they cant use eit zones aswell or only small ones used for minigame building (thats a thign in EEU where there is a minigame wiht a few spots as tiny edit zones and oy uhave to build th eminigame rightly to pass it)

2b55b5g · 2020-03-25 12:04:11

if you don't want trollers to troll for the 2nd time in free edit worlds, don't give the code. manually give edit to players.

XxAtillaxX · 2020-03-25 16:15:33

skullz17 wrote:

But when you think of the rules in EE, things like harassment and bullying are not allowed, so it's not much of a stretch to imagine purposely causing grief by trolling being against the rules.

It's much more akin to a form of protest rather than harassment. Which, of course, should be protected.

Tomahawk wrote:

As the world’s most popular fruit, bananas account for roughly 75 percent of the tropical fruit trade and more than a hundred billion are eaten annually. I could connect this to the point I'm making but apparently it's obvious. ~Sarcastic quip aside, who's to say that a majority of people wouldn't want the players who trolled their work to get smacked?

I doubt the point I was making flew over your head. I don't think the majority of people would condone actual violence though. :^)

Official Everybody Edits Forums

#26 2020-03-24 15:38:17

Re: should troll be reportwhrotly in EE?

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#43 2020-03-24 21:48:55

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#44 2020-03-24 21:51:54

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#49 2020-03-25 12:04:11

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Re: should troll be reportwhrotly in EE?

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