Mafia 33 [Friday Wins!]

Different55 · 2019-10-19 13:06:46

I largely agree with Onjit's reads.

NorwegianboyEE wrote:

And yes i agree about Diff. In fact he hasn’t voted a single time yet. An way to avoid any negative attention maybe? That’s why i was hesistant to townlean him.
And i’ve got the same gripes with ShadowsEdge, but he seems to do it almost all games. He has this bad tendency of merely "commentating" on what’s going on, rather than finding actual scumreads and pushing them. Town can’t win if they don’t play somewhat aggressively and use their votes to pressure the mafia into scumtelling.

I was never a fan of the wagon yesterday and I'm not going to assist in creating another unmovable wagon so early in the day. But I agree, I should at least have my vote active out here.

Vote NorwegianboyEE

Norwee · 2019-10-19 13:11:51

Now you just need to explain why you suspect me and you're in the game Diff.

mrjawapa · 2019-10-19 13:25:04

NorwegianboyEE wrote:

@Jawp
My biggest gripes was that your D1 reasoning for suspecting Daneeko and NoNK is bad. Not specifically the fact that you scumread them.

I disagree.

Why did you suspect him?

Norwee · 2019-10-19 13:31:00

@MrJawapa
I suspected Daneeko when he made this post:

Daneeko wrote:

well, what's there left to do?

You suspected both him and NoNK before that for a different reason.

Different55 · 2019-10-19 14:41:59

NorwegianboyEE wrote:

Now you just need to explain why you suspect me and you're in the game Diff.

Partially because you drove the peace wagon using the "he's playing his scum game" excuse that everyone echoed back at each other and it got a townie lynched. Easily possible that's an accident, but, like JaWapa pointed out, at one point you said that you didn't care if he was a townie. PR or not we need townies.

Also partially just the aggressiveness of your play style this game. If you were scum you'd be in a good position to do what Mutantdevle (and you, I guess) have tried to do in past games.

TaskManager · 2019-10-19 14:52:37

I've had a slight scum lean on Norboy for a while now that I chose not to share earlier

I was his teammate in Mafia 31 and he was really fond of the strategy of playing aggressively as a mafia player to steer the town to disaster
Since we won that game, he might as well use it again next time he's mafia, and I speculate that could be this game right there right now
His random voting right at the start of the game (1, 2) could be him setting the basis for this playstyle, i.e. trying to seem as a strong aggressive player from the get-go.

There's also another thing that I found odd, but that could be just me being paranoid:
Norboy started very eagerly defending myself and crybaby when Peace said we're a scum team. Why? It's not like people barely listen to Peace's attacks anyway and it was pretty much a random shot from him
I believe that Norboy could set that up so that in case he flips scum, these posts can be used to show connection between myself (and crybaby but he's dead rip) and Norboy, and get me lynched
The posts that I'm talking about:

NorwegianboyEE wrote:

peace wrote:
really feeling noweg/tasl/cry scum team
So i think it's safe to say that me/Task and Crybaby are definitely town if Peace flips red.

NorwegianboyEE wrote:

No Peace, i’m not voting you because you voted me. I don’t really care about that. It was mostly your post that put me/Taskmanager and Crybaby as the scum team.

(^ is this OMGUS? I thought we were voting peace because his behavior was similar to last time he was mafia)

NorwegianboyEE wrote:

Meanwhile Peace is basically just going: "Yeah i think Norw/Task/Crybaby is scum lel"

NorwegianboyEE wrote:

2: TaskManager and Crybaby had barely even posted real content or voted anyone before you accused them of being scum. Can you explain what posts by Task and Crybaby made you believe that they are scum?
3: What is the connection between me and Cry/Task?

So here's that
However, a counter point to that is "Why would scum Norboy support killing Crybaby at night if he's trying to build up a fake connection with him?"

Also I don't know what to think of Kira rn
His spontaneous vote on Norboy is scummy, but then he posed it as not serious and didn't make any more posts after unvoting

Onjit, Slabdrill

Norwee · 2019-10-19 14:58:33

@Different55
Just because Peace claimed VT it doesn’t free him from his scummy behaviour and bad responses to my questioning, the reason i asked to roleclaim was to ensure that on the slim chance that he was town, we weren’t lynching any PR’s. It is also interesting that you bring up Mutantdevle. I do feel like i’m in a similar position as him in purgatorEE, where i do my best to argue for lynching someone i think is scum, realize i’m wrong. Then i’ll get the blame while the mafia hides behind my actions. Saying i "drove" the Peace wagon is easy, but if you look back on what actuslly happened, you’ll realize that Taskmanager made the first vote, and then it quickly grew once i put the second vote. Why should i be the scapegoat when there was clearly already big suspicion shared by everyone about Peace’s behaviour?

TaskManager · 2019-10-19 15:02:12

Why, yes, I trusted your post about peace's similar behavior, that's why I started the wagon

Norwee · 2019-10-19 15:06:49

@TaskManager
So you and i started the wagon and we both believed it was very likely that Peace was scum.
Don't you find it interesting how Different55 targets me as the suspicious one when you were attempting to lynch Peace with about the same amount of conviction as i did?

ShadowsEdge · 2019-10-19 15:06:57

First, I want to talk about this:

NorwegianboyEE wrote:

When you get time i would REALLY like you to be more active in questioning suspects. Because if you're just going to commentate on what people are doing and leave it at that, you're acting exactly like you did when you just cruised to the scum team victory in French Revolution mafia. I was being dishonest when i brought up these points in universe mafia because i was scum and looked for an excuse to eliminate you, but there was a certain core of truth in what i said which is really fueling my paranoia right now. I know you're highly capable of maintaining an image of innocence as a scum player.

I'll take a closer look into the interactions between players, and how that fits with my own ideas of how the game is currently going. Although, as I mentioned before, I do have a comp today, so it'll have to wait until later today. I would try to do it now, but if I try to limit myself in the little time I have before I have to go, the analysis would be short, bare bone, and generally would just seem rushed (Because of the timespan). I can do it later in the day, but just at the moment, I feel like doing it now would just be a waste.

I will, however, put my own spin on the whole Norwegian situation that seems to be arising. Personally, I don't think his aggressive playstyle is enough, currently, to justify the situation. Norwegian used an aggressive approach last game on me, and a few others. And again, in this game, he takes the same approach where he's being aggressive (Namely Peace). I could very well be wrong, but given the proximity of the game, and the outcome of the game (Norwegian was heavily suspected because of his aggressiveness), I don't think it would be really logical for Norwegian to take the same approach, which ultimately led to his downfall, if he were Mafia. And to me, it just doesn't make sense in general for him to take the same approach which would logically make him the most suspicious.

As I wrote this, Task wrote something of similar thoughts. But in my opinion, it would still make the most sense for Norwegian to take a different approach, if he was mafia again, because his aggressiveness is what made me, along with others, suspicious of him, and ultimately led to him being revealed as Mafia.

Anyway, I can't do much more than that, I do want to put my thoughts into that. I really have to get going now, so I'm sorry to cut this short.

TaskManager · 2019-10-19 15:11:14

NorwegianboyEE wrote:

@TaskManager
So you and i started the wagon and we both believed it was very likely that Peace was scum.
Don't you find it interesting how Different55 targets me as the suspicious one when you were attempting to lynch Peace with about the same amount of conviction as i did?

Yeah no don't pull me into that
You're also getting the blame for this:

Different55 wrote:

like JaWapa pointed out, at one point you said that you didn't care if he was a townie. PR or not we need townies.
Also partially just the aggressiveness of your play style this game. If you were scum you'd be in a good position to do what Mutantdevle (and you, I guess) have tried to do in past games.

Norwee · 2019-10-19 15:12:12

Yeah i already responded to that.

TaskManager · 2019-10-19 15:13:34

NorwegianboyEE wrote:

Yeah i already responded to that.

ok so what

Norwee · 2019-10-19 15:15:42

TaskManager wrote:

NorwegianboyEE wrote:
Yeah i already responded to that.
ok so what

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

NoNK · 2019-10-19 15:19:57

Haha, this game is really starting to heat up. Sure would be nice if I wasn't hilariously swamped with work. I'm going to give this game a proper read sometime today, but right now I'm getting bad vibes from shadow and diff due to the whole non-agression thing they're playing, not sure what to think of jawapa being super defensive and replying to every single thing point by point which feels choppy. I don't like the norwegianboy wagon, I think that's scum backed (diff) for sure. Lynching norwegian d2 is pretty awful imo because due to the nature of his agression he's going to make his alignment super obvious once we get into midgame.

Probably going to do a manual vote count when I reread because I have no idea where the wagons are.

yeah I think there's enough content to get a read on almost anyone now except maybe slab/zelda, I'll have to give it a read today. Also if Kira could go ahead and start reading like he

Norwee

Norwee · 2019-10-19 15:32:59

NoNK wrote:

Also if Kira could go ahead and start reading like he

Truer words have never been spoken.

Slabdrill, Onjit

Norwee · 2019-10-19 15:47:58

TaskManager wrote:

Yeah no don't pull me into that

That response isn't good enough.
Try answering again:

NorwegianboyEE wrote:

Don't you find it interesting how Different55 targets me as the suspicious one when you were attempting to lynch Peace with about the same amount of conviction as i did?

Or to rephrase it: Different55 blames me solely for the Peace wagon (as can be evidenced from his vote on me and his complaining about my "aggression"), when there were a lot of other people loudly criticizing Peace and openly speculating that he might be scum.

mrjawapa · 2019-10-19 16:00:40

NorwegianboyEE wrote:

@MrJawapa
I suspected Daneeko when he made this post:
Daneeko wrote:
well, what's there left to do?
You suspected both him and NoNK before that for a different reason.

This post, along with everything I've mentioned earlier, make him look really bad. I don't know why you're calling me scum for suspecting Daneeko, when you also suspected him.

NorwegianboyEE wrote:

Saying i "drove" the Peace wagon is easy, but if you look back on what actuslly happened, you’ll realize that Taskmanager made the first vote, and then it quickly grew once i put the second vote. Why should i be the scapegoat when there was clearly already big suspicion shared by everyone about Peace’s behaviour?

NorwegianboyEE wrote:

Different55 blames me solely for the Peace wagon (as can be evidenced from his vote on me and his complaining about my "aggression"), when there were a lot of other people loudly criticizing Peace and openly speculating that he might be scum.

I don't think anyone disagrees that Peace's post was super aggressive and looked scummy.

The issue is, you pushed the wagon kinda hard. You really wanted him lynched. And you were wrong. When peace claimed townie, you basically said you didn't care, you were hammering him anyway. If you are town, that's ridiculous, and a terrible play.

Norwee · 2019-10-19 16:09:22

mrjawapa wrote:

When peace claimed townie, you basically said you didn't care, you were hammering him anyway. If you are town, that's ridiculous, and a terrible play.

Ok, this is a terrible argument. Why should i believe Peace because he claimed townie? Do you honestly think someone saying "I'm town!" makes them innocent?

Norwee · 2019-10-19 16:11:03

Btw i'm a townie. Haha! I claimed it! Now there's no way i'm mafia!!

Different55 · 2019-10-19 16:24:00

NorwegianboyEE wrote:

@TaskManager
So you and i started the wagon and we both believed it was very likely that Peace was scum.
Don't you find it interesting how Different55 targets me as the suspicious one when you were attempting to lynch Peace with about the same amount of conviction as i did?

I thought you were the one who started the wagon (considering Task says he used your reasoning to vote for him, sounds like you started the wagon even without voting for him first), and it was your reasoning that everyone recycled to keep the wagon rolling.

I'm not saying you're scum, I'm saying I don't like the way you're playing and it makes me suspicious. More than anyone else at the moment who doesn't already have the beginnings of a wagon going on them.

NorwegianboyEE wrote:

Btw i'm a townie. Haha! I claimed it! Now there's no way i'm mafia!!

...This isn't helping. D1 is over now, even Kira claims he's going to be getting serious.

The wagon on Peace was obviously backed by maf. L-1 twice within 4 hours. That should have been *everyone's* giant neon sign that we were on the wrong track. But everyone pushed on, you notably claiming that you didn't care that Peace was probably a townie. Not because he said so, but because the maf was obviously pushing for that particular lynch.

NorwegianboyEE wrote:

Or to rephrase it: Different55 blames me solely for the Peace wagon (as can be evidenced from his vote on me and his complaining about my "aggression"), when there were a lot of other people loudly criticizing Peace and openly speculating that he might be scum.

Again, all parroting your reasoning. You drove that wagon. Whether intentionally or by simply being wrong, either is possible and I'm not against you for that reason alone. My problem with you is your reaction and attitude surrounding all of the events of yesterday.

mrjawapa

TaskManager · 2019-10-19 16:27:03

NorwegianboyEE wrote:

That response isn't good enough.

Why did you not say that in your initial reply to my post?

NorwegianboyEE wrote:

Or to rephrase it: Different55 blames me solely for the Peace wagon (as can be evidenced from his vote on me and his complaining about my "aggression"), when there were a lot of other people loudly criticizing Peace and openly speculating that he might be scum.

No.
From what I can tell, Diff blames you specifically for the way you pushed it
There's a lot of people that pushed the wagon but not everyone was so aggressive about it

Plus, I find this post unnecessary and scummy:

Norboy wrote:

No Peace, i’m not voting you because you voted me. I don’t really care about that. It was mostly your post that put me/Taskmanager and Crybaby as the scum team.

Was that really the primary reason why you pushed Peace wagon?

NoNK · 2019-10-19 17:16:58

I skimmed a few iso's, here's my take on the game.

{ Onjit, Taskmanager } -- Might be a bit unpopular putting taskmanager so high on my readslist, but he's actually super different this game then he is as mafia. If you read his latest posts against norwegianboy, while I do disagree with him, he's clearly using some logic that I don't expect scum task to pull out, I would expect him to sheep in a more hands off way if he was maf. Onjit is chilltown 4 life.

{ Norwegianboy, Daneeko } -- Town lynchbait tier. These are the people who I think are town that have likely been pushed on by scum. Kira and diff are suspects for trying to mislynch the day 1 leader. It makes sense in context with how the mafia seems to be playing, since mafia made a zero information nightkill last night, they most likely see him as mislynchable.

{ ZeldaXD, Slabdrill } null tier

{ Jawapa } Jawapa is being defensive, for some reason he keeps going down lists of quotes and replying and defending himself. I don't think that makes him mafia in and of itself, and I feel like there are better suspects to look into today. Scumlean, but like, not lynchworthy.

{ Kira, Shadowsedge } - There's good reason to suspect both of these people. Kira for the sus votes, shadowsedge for playing game narrator. However, we are waiting on both of them to reply to posts, so these are both volatile positions, liable to shoot up or down depending on future events

{ Different55 } - Textbook EE forums scum. He let the mislynch on peace happen by not really doing much about it except for lightly voicing how he didn't like it. Now that the wagon passed, he's attacking the guy who lead the wagon. This is scummy for a few reasons:

1. wagon leaders are less likely to be mafia, mafia tend to jump on wagons, (obviously this isn't a 100%, obviously mafia can and do lead wagons but less so on day 1 where they're going to draw a lot of attention to themself)
2. While there likely was mafia on the wagon, attacking the townie who lead the wagon does not help to find the mafia(s) who hopped on the wagon, it actually distracts from that
3. Once the wagon leader flips town, everyone just forgets about the fact that there was probably mafia on that wagon because the leader just flipped green, allowing mafia to push their agenda without getting any blood on their hands

Also another reason for scumreading diff

4. There are a lot of wagons right now, and of all the people being talked about, diff is getting talked about only casually, and getting basically 0 votes or actual pressure on him. The slow speed of the suspicion on diff is scum indicative.

I think there's a considerable chance his motivation right now is to be pushing town!norwgian to distract from his partners who were on the wagon and are currently under suspicion (Kira?), though it's unlikely all of that falls perfectly into place just due to how theories don't usually work out perfect in mafia.

I;m still keeping my vote on Kira since this game has majority lynches, and I don't think the momentum is there for a diff lynch today (plus lynching kira gives information about diff, potentially a 2 for 1 combo meal deal), but if a wagon starts building there I 100% intend to hop on.

Norwee, Slabdrill

ZeldaXD · 2019-10-19 17:31:08

I disagree with the "Kira is scum" narrative, we know by experience that Kira does a lot of sus things and seemingly unlogical stuff when he is town (the best example is the last game (not voice mafia))... Kira is intelligent enough to know what his posts look like to others, I doubt scum kira would quickly go to lynch the person who initiated a wagon against a townie. Shadows' behaviour is the same every game imo, he never actually pushes for lynches unless he is very sure, just gives his input (often very good).

Norwee · 2019-10-19 17:31:10

NoNK wrote:

I;m still keeping my vote on Kira since this game has majority lynches, and I don't think the momentum is there for a diff lynch today (plus lynching kira gives information about diff, potentially a 2 for 1 combo meal deal), but if a wagon starts building there I 100% intend to hop on.

I don't know if you've noticed, but us two are in fact the only one's voting for Kira right now, so if we both switch our votes to Different55 we'll be able to gauge how people react to it.

Official Everybody Edits Forums

#226 2019-10-19 13:06:46

Re: Mafia 33 [Friday Wins!]

Vote NorwegianboyEE

#227 2019-10-19 13:11:51

Re: Mafia 33 [Friday Wins!]

#228 2019-10-19 13:25:04

Re: Mafia 33 [Friday Wins!]

#229 2019-10-19 13:31:00

Re: Mafia 33 [Friday Wins!]

#230 2019-10-19 14:41:59

Re: Mafia 33 [Friday Wins!]

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Re: Mafia 33 [Friday Wins!]

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Re: Mafia 33 [Friday Wins!]

#233 2019-10-19 15:02:12

Re: Mafia 33 [Friday Wins!]

#234 2019-10-19 15:06:49

Re: Mafia 33 [Friday Wins!]

#235 2019-10-19 15:06:57

Re: Mafia 33 [Friday Wins!]

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Re: Mafia 33 [Friday Wins!]

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Re: Mafia 33 [Friday Wins!]

#238 2019-10-19 15:13:34

Re: Mafia 33 [Friday Wins!]

#239 2019-10-19 15:15:42

Re: Mafia 33 [Friday Wins!]

#240 2019-10-19 15:19:57

Re: Mafia 33 [Friday Wins!]

#241 2019-10-19 15:32:59

Re: Mafia 33 [Friday Wins!]

#242 2019-10-19 15:47:58

Re: Mafia 33 [Friday Wins!]

#243 2019-10-19 16:00:40

Re: Mafia 33 [Friday Wins!]

#244 2019-10-19 16:09:22

Re: Mafia 33 [Friday Wins!]

#245 2019-10-19 16:11:03

Re: Mafia 33 [Friday Wins!]

#246 2019-10-19 16:24:00

Re: Mafia 33 [Friday Wins!]

#247 2019-10-19 16:27:03

Re: Mafia 33 [Friday Wins!]

#248 2019-10-19 17:16:58

Re: Mafia 33 [Friday Wins!]

#249 2019-10-19 17:31:08

Re: Mafia 33 [Friday Wins!]

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Re: Mafia 33 [Friday Wins!]

/Vote Different55

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