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#1 2017-08-23 18:14:26

Luka504
Member
From: Serbia,probs never heard of it
Joined: 2015-02-19
Posts: 1,516

A better tutorial.

Honestly i don't know why i made this topic, it's pretty much clear how most of the staff doesn't care about actually fixing the game. But if the blue moon on a friday 13th occurs maybe they might even do something who knows?

Let's be honest here. EE is not welcoming for new players. Like, at all.
And since we need new players for this game to survive, this is a pretty serious issue.
I can go on for ages on how EE needs to be fixed but for now i'm talking just about the tutorial. No not the tutorial campaign, just the jumble of text you get when you first join the world.

I'm pretty sure we all did the same thing when we saw this.
PmqTfKU6QNmgevSMHLNaxw.png

Whose great idea was it to make the first thing you see in this game 3 minutes of tedious text? Do you think people are gonna remember what you ''taught'' them in this tutorial? I read the entire thing and if you were to ask me to re-tell it, i wouldn't remember anything. Text is the absolute worst way to deliver a tutorial. Almost every other way is better than text. I have once heard a story about a person who joined EE, spent a few seconds looking a the tutorial, and was like ''lol nope'' and left EE before even joining a world. This is bad. If your tutorial repels players then don't be suprised when the playercount starts dropping.

So how do we fix this?
First things first, abolish this stupid tutorial we have now.
And instead just drop the player into Tutorial #1 on the campaign and make sure their Go To Lobby button is sealed off. As soon as their account is created, *POOF* Tutorial time. This way it is guaranteed that the player will get a taste of EE's gameplay and will know how the basic controls and physics of EE work. Make sure they are not allowed to click the goto lobby button until after they finish the tutorial campaign. As soon as they finish the 3rd tutorial, they should be sent to their empty home world (which btw should be larger since a 40x30 world is just sad) and allow them to doodle around, fly around in godmode and try on different smileys. They can stay as long or leave as soon as they desire. Maybe a player or two will join the world and welcome them into EE.
When they click the Go to Lobby button, i would recommend locking everything behind an energy paywall. They would need to buy a bundle that unlocks everything else (Make it like 5 energy). This might sound stupid, but i do know a person who joined EE and didn't even know that you can spend energy to buy stuff. This way the player knows how the energy system works and knows their max energy. After that they can do whatever they desire. Join a world, spend more of their energy, maybe even log off and come back to play again later.

Anyway, that is it for now. This is just the beggining of what i think needs fixing in EE, for example the shop system and what types of worlds should be promoted in EE. I might talk more about them if i don't procrastinate 8 hours to do so.


How long will it take me to get banned again?
Place your bets right here.

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#2 2017-08-23 19:41:29

some man
Member
From: New England
Joined: 2015-02-15
Posts: 8,759

Re: A better tutorial.

Okay, but imagine someone who already knows how to play the game decides to create an account. Do they still need to go through the tutorial campaign every time they sign up? This would especially be horrible for bot accounts.

I say we should just shorten the "text tutorial". When the player goes in the shop for the first time, just have a line of text tell them how everything can be bought via energy or gems, and one energy comes to you every 2 minutes. Add a few other lines corresponding to worlds, campaigns, and whatever else the text tutorial tries so hard to explain.

Or redesign the menu so that it's easier to understand and nothing needs to be explained.

Last edited by some man (2017-08-23 19:49:37)


Thanks Zoey!
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#3 2017-08-23 19:56:34

Devlin
Member
From: Hell
Joined: 2015-03-31
Posts: 1,076
Website

Re: A better tutorial.

some man wrote:

Okay, but imagine someone who already knows how to play the game decides to create an account. Do they still need to go through the tutorial campaign every time they sign up? This would especially be horrible for bot accounts.

It's not that hard to speed run the tutorials... I am sure many people would be fine with doing that. It could also reduce the amount of spam bots and bots like that as some people may not want to put that effort in.

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#4 2017-08-23 20:04:19

some man
Member
From: New England
Joined: 2015-02-15
Posts: 8,759

Re: A better tutorial.

Devlin wrote:
some man wrote:

Okay, but imagine someone who already knows how to play the game decides to create an account. Do they still need to go through the tutorial campaign every time they sign up? This would especially be horrible for bot accounts.

It's not that hard to speed run the tutorials... I am sure many people would be fine with doing that. It could also reduce the amount of spam bots and bots like that as some people may not want to put that effort in.

Plot twist: imagine you're not fast. Imagine it took you ten minutes to get through the tutorials. Maybe you just want to create another account and not have to go through the same "user-friendliness" every time.
Although the tutorial campaign is important, so maybe once the player signs up, suggest they check it out if they're still familiarizing themselves with the game.

Last edited by some man (2017-08-23 20:05:19)


Thanks Zoey!
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#5 2017-08-23 20:08:40

Kirby
Member
Joined: 2015-04-04
Posts: 3,648

Re: A better tutorial.

Luka504 wrote:

Go To Lobby button is sealed off.

i agree with everything up to here. unskippable tutorials are dujmb. Maybe there can be an "are you sure" screen if you click goto lobby on the tutorial, but there should still be a way to skip it.

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#6 2017-08-23 20:11:27

ilikecorndogs
Member
Joined: 2015-08-01
Posts: 62

Re: A better tutorial.

some man wrote:
Devlin wrote:
some man wrote:

Okay, but imagine someone who already knows how to play the game decides to create an account. Do they still need to go through the tutorial campaign every time they sign up? This would especially be horrible for bot accounts.

It's not that hard to speed run the tutorials... I am sure many people would be fine with doing that. It could also reduce the amount of spam bots and bots like that as some people may not want to put that effort in.

Plot twist: imagine you're not fast. Imagine it took you ten minutes to get through the tutorials. Maybe you just want to create another account and not have to go through the same "user-friendliness" every time.
Although the tutorial campaign is important, so maybe once the player signs up, suggest they check it out if they're still familiarizing themselves with the game.

How about a 'make alt' button in settings, which would bring a prompt of a username, email, and password (usual account creation) that plops you into the lobby as the new account, with the 'unlock everything' pack purchased. Maybe even have this open up in a new tab, so you don't lose your main account's control.

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#7 2017-08-23 20:28:45

Kikikan
Member
From: Hungary
Joined: 2015-08-10
Posts: 102

Re: A better tutorial.

some man wrote:

Imagine it took you ten minutes to get through the tutorials.

Yes you are right, for an experienced user, completing a tutorial on simple game mechanics and UI must take ages.


cfhT14Q.jpg
El. Psy. Congroo.

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#8 2017-08-23 21:00:34

some man
Member
From: New England
Joined: 2015-02-15
Posts: 8,759

Re: A better tutorial.

Kikikan wrote:
some man wrote:

Imagine it took you ten minutes to get through the tutorials.

Yes you are right, for an experienced user, completing a tutorial on simple game mechanics and UI must take ages.

Okay, imagine you're just plain annoyed by having to go through three levels every time you want to set up an account. Maybe it doesn't take a long time but you're just annoyed. Do you suddenly not have a right to be annoyed? Do you need to be force-fed things like "time gates turn on and then they turn off" just because you want to make a bot account?

Last edited by some man (2017-08-23 21:01:46)


Thanks Zoey!
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#9 2017-08-23 21:05:07

Luka504
Member
From: Serbia,probs never heard of it
Joined: 2015-02-19
Posts: 1,516

Re: A better tutorial.

First of all i wanna remind you that this is just my personal ideas, off course there is room for improvement.
However i still think that the tutorial should not be skippable, for a number of reasons.
Firstly, the alt issue.
I'm sorry for anyone who has to waste a few precious minutes of their lives to complete the tutorial. But is it that big of a hassle to do the tutorial? People tend to have 1, maybe even 2 alts, very rarely do they have or need more. This means they only need to play tutorial only 3 times at most. I don't know if it's just me, but I've replayed the tutorial dozens of times since it's an amazing triology that takes a few minutes to complete. I think anyone who really needs an alt is willing to play and enjoy the tutorial once more.
Remeber Shovel Knight? You HAVE to replay the tutorial if you start New Game+. Yet not once have i seen anybody ever complain how it is a waste of time.

Secondly, the noob issue.
Let's for the sake of argument, say that the person who plays the campaigns is the biggest noob at video games imaginable. And let's say he takes 10 minutes on his first run. And let's say that he wants to make an alt as soon as he finishes the tutorial. Even though he is still bad at video games, on his second play through he knows what to expect, and therefore can blaze through the level quicker than before. It's just common sense. The more you play a videogame the better you are at it.
But considering the likelyhood of this happening is rather low, its safe to rule this out.

Thirdly, it could decrease harassement. Not by a lot, but it still can. If you keep getting banned and keep making alts then you have to do the tutorial every time you want to make an alt. This is even worse if you need multiple alts to flood a world. Not being able to skip the tutorial might discourage harrasers and spammers, which is a definite plus in my book.


How long will it take me to get banned again?
Place your bets right here.

Luka504.png

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#10 2017-08-23 21:27:00

some man
Member
From: New England
Joined: 2015-02-15
Posts: 8,759

Re: A better tutorial.

Shovel Knight and Everybody Edits are completely different games. In Shovel Knight, every time you start it's because you want to play. In EE, accounts can be started with the purpose of actually playing, OR just automatically issuing commands and placing blocks, i.e. a bot.
Besides, reading the current "text tutorial" takes about as much time as it does to complete the tutorial campaign. If the tutorial campaign was unskippable and took about 3 minutes for the average player to complete, creating a main account and 2 alts would add up to 6 wasted minutes- only the first 3 minutes would be teaching something the player doesn't already know.

And sure, it would decrease unneeded alts, but it would also tick off people who just want to make another account and have a perfectly good reason for doing so. You wouldn't be fending off harassment with this, you'd just be briefly slowing it down.


Thanks Zoey!
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#11 2017-08-23 21:28:41

Devlin
Member
From: Hell
Joined: 2015-03-31
Posts: 1,076
Website

Re: A better tutorial.

some man wrote:
Kikikan wrote:
some man wrote:

Imagine it took you ten minutes to get through the tutorials.

Yes you are right, for an experienced user, completing a tutorial on simple game mechanics and UI must take ages.

Okay, imagine you're just plain annoyed by having to go through three levels every time you want to set up an account. Maybe it doesn't take a long time but you're just annoyed. Do you suddenly not have a right to be annoyed? Do you need to be force-fed things like "time gates turn on and then they turn off" just because you want to make a bot account?

Your slight inconvenience means nothing when compared to the potential new players the game could keep. I don't exactly get how you could be making so many new accounts that a few minutes of unneeded gameplay becomes a problem. Of course you have the right to be annoyed, but you forget that your annoyance doesn't really matter at all.

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#12 2017-08-23 21:39:36

some man
Member
From: New England
Joined: 2015-02-15
Posts: 8,759

Re: A better tutorial.

Devlin wrote:
some man wrote:
Kikikan wrote:
some man wrote:

Imagine it took you ten minutes to get through the tutorials.

Yes you are right, for an experienced user, completing a tutorial on simple game mechanics and UI must take ages.

Okay, imagine you're just plain annoyed by having to go through three levels every time you want to set up an account. Maybe it doesn't take a long time but you're just annoyed. Do you suddenly not have a right to be annoyed? Do you need to be force-fed things like "time gates turn on and then they turn off" just because you want to make a bot account?

Your slight inconvenience means nothing when compared to the potential new players the game could keep. I don't exactly get how you could be making so many new accounts that a few minutes of unneeded gameplay becomes a problem. Of course you have the right to be annoyed, but you forget that your annoyance doesn't really matter at all.

My solution wouldn't keep new players away either, the only way it would keep them from coming in is if they would be annoyed to death from seeing this:
checkitout.png

Last edited by some man (2017-08-23 21:40:16)


Thanks Zoey!
L4T3R7Z.png

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#13 2017-08-23 22:12:55

ilikecorndogs
Member
Joined: 2015-08-01
Posts: 62

Re: A better tutorial.

some man wrote:
Devlin wrote:
some man wrote:
Kikikan wrote:
some man wrote:

Imagine it took you ten minutes to get through the tutorials.

Yes you are right, for an experienced user, completing a tutorial on simple game mechanics and UI must take ages.

Okay, imagine you're just plain annoyed by having to go through three levels every time you want to set up an account. Maybe it doesn't take a long time but you're just annoyed. Do you suddenly not have a right to be annoyed? Do you need to be force-fed things like "time gates turn on and then they turn off" just because you want to make a bot account?

Your slight inconvenience means nothing when compared to the potential new players the game could keep. I don't exactly get how you could be making so many new accounts that a few minutes of unneeded gameplay becomes a problem. Of course you have the right to be annoyed, but you forget that your annoyance doesn't really matter at all.

My solution wouldn't keep new players away either, the only way it would keep them from coming in is if they would be annoyed to death from seeing this:
https://s29.postimg.org/ql3jg9h7r/checkitout.png

If you look above, I put a solution to all of these problems, so please read and consider that before continuing on this 'debate'.

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#14 2017-08-24 16:47:54

Gosha
Member
From: Russia
Joined: 2015-03-15
Posts: 4,382

Re: A better tutorial.

you don't need tutorials
you need a better lobby
how easy is that

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Gosha1503589674674691

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