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nlmdejonge · Before February 2015

I don't know if this has been mentioned/discussed before, but I would like to always show up for threads with posts I haven't read before.
Currently it only does so for threads with new posts since my last login.
This means I either need to read everything before logging out or I can never logout - or whatever.
It should remember across sessions which threads have unread posts.

Different55 · Before February 2015

In order to do that, the forum would have to keep track of every thread you've ever visited, and when the last time you've visited it was. The forum would have to keep track of that for every forum member. That's 142,543,548 new entries in the database if it were added, and it would be 5,000 new entries every time a topic is created, one for each member. I don't know for sure how this would play out in real life, but it'd likely end in long page loads on the index page, forum pages, and search pages. It's much cheaper in terms of computing power to just check whether or not there have been any posts since your last visit, especially since last post dates are recorded in the topic metadata (Is that the right word? It feels like the right word, but I can't say I've ever used that word before. I don't like it. In any case, last post dates and the username of the person who last posted are stored along with topic title, owner, number of views, number of replies, stuff like that.)

tl;dr: Probably a bad idea, unless someone can come up with a more efficient way to keep track of what users have visited which topics and when.

Last edited by Different55 (Jun 30 2014 10:20:53 am)

Buzzerbee · Before February 2015

Why do you need to log out? Do you have a sibling or someone who uses these forums too on your same account?

nlmdejonge · Before February 2015

I'm now checking "Log me in automatically each time I visit." and never logout, hopefully that fixes it.

Last edited by nlmdejonge (Jun 30 2014 4:52:20 pm)

nlmdejonge · Before February 2015

Mousey123 wrote:

That doesn't, actually. I've checked that and I saw posts yesterday but didn't check on them, so today the check mark was gone.

Yes, and also the other way around: when I look at posts and return after five minutes the threads are marked as unread again (without any new posts).

Different55 wrote:

[...], unless someone can come up with a more efficient way to keep track of what users have visited which topics and when.

What you wrote is in the right direction, except there wouldn't be 142+ million entries. You'd only have to add an entry when a member actually visits a thread. If the thread+user combination isn't in the table, that's enough to know the user didn't visit the thread at all. As far as "mark forums read" functionality goes, that wouldn't add all threads for the user; only a single datetime you could then check against. (You can sorta check how phpBB does this here.)

Or maybe use a FluxBB to phpBB converter, since FluxBB apparently lacks the "Unread message tracking" functionality. If you check the forum software comparison on Wikipedia and sort the "Unread message tracking" column, you can see FluxBB only checks sessions. (And it doesn't even really do that.) Full unread message checking is the way to go...

Different55 · Before February 2015

nlmdejonge wrote:

Mousey123 wrote:
That doesn't, actually. I've checked that and I saw posts yesterday but didn't check on them, so today the check mark was gone.
Yes, and also the other way around: when I look at posts and return after five minutes the threads are marked as unread again (without any new posts).

The way things are set up here, after 1800 seconds (Sorry, too tired at the moment to convert to minutes) users are automatically logged out. Maybe if it was set to 0, you'd have something similar to what you wanted.

I feel like something's poking me in the brain that I'm missing but I can't figure out what it is. How does the forum keep track of what topic's people have read right now? Is it cookies? Could we do that on the scale of the whole forum? Is that what would happen if the visit timeout were set to 0? We'd lose the "Last Visit" feature, but it's not used very often. Would setting it to 0 even work?

Different55 wrote:
[...], unless someone can come up with a more efficient way to keep track of what users have visited which topics and when.
What you wrote is in the right direction, except there wouldn't be 142+ million entries. You'd only have to add an entry when a member actually visits a thread. If the thread+user combination isn't in the table, that's enough to know the user didn't visit the thread at all. As far as "mark forums read" functionality goes, that wouldn't add all threads for the user; only a single datetime you could then check against. (You can sorta check how phpBB does this here.)

Fair point, but that's still a buttload of entries. One for every topic each user has visited, which has the potential to be as many as 142 million, but realistically is nowhere near that.

I'll read the link. If it seems simple enough, I might make a FluxBB mod for it, but I still wouldn't expect Atilla or Meredith to add it over here, though. If phpBB can do it without slowing to a crawl, then so can FluxBB.

Or maybe use a FluxBB to phpBB converter, since FluxBB apparently lacks the "Unread message tracking" functionality. If you check the forum software comparison on Wikipedia and sort the "Unread message tracking" column, you can see FluxBB only checks sessions. (And it doesn't even really do that.) Full unread message checking is the way to go...

Ew, phpBB.

Anyway, I doubt Atilla and/or Meredith would go for migrating the entire forums just for one missing feature.

Last edited by Different55 (Jul 1 2014 8:12:04 am)

nlmdejonge · Before February 2015

Different55 wrote:

Fair point, but that's still a buttload of entries. One for every topic each user has visited, which has the potential to be as many as 142 million, but realistically is nowhere near that.

As you write, in practice it's nowhere near 142+ million. Unlike phpBB, FluxBB has no option to do a user search by "Last Active", but it's probably safe to say - in general, about forums - that less than 1/4th of all forum members still visit the forum, even excluding banned members. And the "mark forums read" feature would be a lifesaver. Every time it's being clicked, all entries for that user can be removed, since everything before that datetime is assumed to have been read (which includes all current threads). If the user has manually read every unread post, the forum software can also remove all entries and update the datetime. You could even do this per board. The table will have way less than 1 million records, possibly even less than 10,000 records. The trick is that the checks for 'non-existing thread+user combinations' and 'posts after the datetime of existing thread+user combinations' are only done for content after that user's overall datetime value.

Different55 wrote:

I might make a FluxBB mod for it, but I still wouldn't expect Atilla or Meredith to add it over here, though. [...] Anyway, I doubt Atilla and/or Meredith would go for migrating the entire forums just for one missing feature.

If you would create a proper FluxBB mod/plug-in for it, which wouldn't be an easy task and quite a bit of work; why do you think it wouldn't be added to this forum? A plug-in like that would probably be well-received in the FluxBB community and would be added a lot more FluxBB installations worldwide than just here. I think someone already tried to create a modification like that, called Persistent unreaded, but given its author's usage of the word "unreaded" it may not be wise to touch it.

Different55 · Before February 2015

nlmdejonge wrote:

Different55 wrote:
I might make a FluxBB mod for it, but I still wouldn't expect Atilla or Meredith to add it over here, though. [...] Anyway, I doubt Atilla and/or Meredith would go for migrating the entire forums just for one missing feature.
If you would create a proper FluxBB mod/plug-in for it, which wouldn't be an easy task and quite a bit of work;

I'd make it, I'm not saying it'd be done any time soon. I've been pretty busy this summer, and it doesn't look like it's going to get any less busy.

why do you think it wouldn't be added to this forum?

Currently, it's just one feature that only one person has requested.

nlmdejonge · Before February 2015

Different55 wrote:

I'd make it, [...]

Seems like an awful lot of work for one feature that only one person has requested.
Better to just enjoy the rest of the summer. (Playing EE, of course.)

skullz17 · Before February 2015

What happens if you go inactive for a while? Will there be loads of unread topics when you come back that will be ticked forever, unless you read them?

Different55 · Before February 2015

I would add a "Mark all as read" button as well as a few other things to prevent massive amounts of unread topics.

nlmdejonge wrote:

Different55 wrote:
I'd make it, [...]
Seems like an awful lot of work for one feature that only one person has requested.
Better to just enjoy the rest of the summer. (Playing EE, of course.)

Lol thanks. I might not play EE, but I'll definitely be making to most of my summer.

Last edited by Different55 (Jul 1 2014 4:02:03 pm)

dragonranger · Before February 2015

Dont we already have a "mark all as read" button?

Last edited by Dragonranger (Jul 1 2014 10:38:20 pm)

Creature · Before February 2015

Dragonranger wrote:

Dont we already have a "mark all as read" button?

Yeah, but it make all read, not few topics.

Haox · Before February 2015

Nah we dont need it

nlmdejonge · 2015-02-18 11:40:50

This forum is still unusable for me, for the same reason I stated in the first post of this thread.
Every time you visit this simpleton-forum it just thinks you've read every new post since your last visit.
In 2015 it's very basic functionality for forums to properly show which threads contain unread posts, but this forum software is too basic to do this.
Maybe export the posts from FluxBB to phpBB or other proper forum software that can actually show users where new posts are.
Yeah, some of you visit this forum all the time and read up on everything, but not everyone is the same.

Another problem is that, for some reason, forum owners appear to prefer really dark backgrounds and colors.
The background is black, the panels are dark gray, and the text color is #b4b4b4 which is also quite dark - light gray on darker gray.
I know it's probably considered 1337 to have such bright bluish links on a dark background, but maybe we should - you know - make posts readable.
Why can't it be day on this website. At the very least make the text color #fff.
The dark colors also give the forum a sad atmosphere. Dark background and light gray text on a darker gray background... come on.

Different55 · 2015-02-18 13:25:14

I'll give that mod you posted a try. Not having perfect English is not something to judge a mod over, there are a lot of FluxBB devs who don't speak English as their first language.
And similar to my post above, I'm not comfortable with replacing the entire forum just for one feature requested by one person.

As for the themes, I can make a lighter colored theme if you want. Or you could make one and request it to be added in Forum Discussion. The reason we prefer dark themes is because it's easier on the eyes. #fff on a dark background like this would be out of place and would look like it was glowing.

nlmdejonge · 2015-02-18 15:10:43

Different55 wrote:

The reason we prefer dark themes is because it's easier on the eyes.

I understand that you think this, but in reality dark text on a light background is far easier on the eyes.

-----
"However, most studies have shown that dark characters on a light background are superior to light characters on a dark background (when the refresh rate is fairly high). For example, Bauer and Cavonius (1980) found that participants were 26% more accurate in reading text when they read it with dark characters on a light background."

Reference: Bauer, D., & Cavonius, C., R. (1980). Improving the legibility of visual display units through contrast reversal. In E. Grandjean, E. Vigliani (Eds.), Ergonomic Aspects of Visual Display Terminals (pp. 137-142). London: Taylor & Francis
-----
"You should avoid using white text on a dark background when displaying paragraph text to make it easier from them to read. Forcing users to fixate on the white text for a long time can strain the user’s eyes."

Reference: http://uxmovement.com/content/when-to-u … ackground/
-----
"People with astigmatism (approximately 50% of the population) find it harder to read white text on black than black text on white. Part of this has to do with light levels: with a bright display (white background) the iris closes a bit more, decreasing the effect of the "deformed" lens; with a dark display (black background) the iris opens to receive more light and the deformation of the lens creates a much fuzzier focus at the eye."

Reference: Jason Harrison – Post Doctoral Fellow, Imager Lab Manager – Sensory Perception and Interaction Research Group, University of British Columbia
-----
"The best color combination for your eyes is black text on a white background, though other dark-on-light combinations also work well."

Reference: http://www.allaboutvision.com/cvs/irritated.htm
-----
"Most people don’t like viewing light text against a dark background on websites because it strains their eyes, making for a much less enjoyable experience."

Reference: http://www.webdesignerdepot.com/2009/08 … eb-design/
-----
"When it comes to color combinations, your eyes prefer black text on a white background or other dark-on-light combinations. Avoid low contrast text/background color schemes."

Reference: http://www.wired.com/2013/09/flux-eyestrain/
-----

And, last but not least, see: http://www.ironicsans.com/owmyeyes/

Different55 · 2015-02-18 15:38:27

Different55 wrote:

As for the themes, I can make a lighter colored theme if you want.

So... Is that a yes?

Michele · 2015-02-18 15:41:33

Different55 wrote:

Different55 wrote:
As for the themes, I can make a lighter colored theme if you want.
So... Is that a yes?

No!

EDIT: No, nooooooooo!

rgl32 · 2015-02-18 15:56:18

I think Different is talking about just adding a light-colored style which you can change in display on your profile, which only changes for you.

nlmdejonge · 2015-02-18 16:10:32

Different55 wrote:

Different55 wrote:
As for the themes, I can make a lighter colored theme if you want.
So... Is that a yes?

Yes!

EDIT: Yes, yeeeeeeees!

Different55 · 2015-02-18 16:17:29

lol got it, I'll get to work on it as soon as I can.

Pingohits · 2015-02-18 17:24:56

can we make light gray+ black, kind of like pencil on white paper?

Different55 · 2015-02-18 17:47:48

I've got a rough sketch uploaded as Snow. It's more or less inverted Coal with a few other tweaks. You can try it out by going to Profile>Display. I'm thinking about lightening the background on boxes a bit more.

Onjit · 2015-02-20 12:21:56

Different55 wrote:

I'm thinking about lightening the background on boxes a bit more.

pls no. i like it the way it is, dark enough to read easily, but not black.

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