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#1 2018-03-10 12:24:03, last edited by Luka504 (2018-03-10 12:25:01)

Luka504
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From: Serbia,probs never heard of it
Joined: 2015-02-19
Posts: 2,933

Speedrunner's dilemma

Disclaimer: I don't know if this dilemma has already been created or if it's a variation of an existing one, but this is something I originally thought of. I didn't do a ctrl C + ctrl V. If something similar has been said before, feel free to send me a link of it.

The Speedrunner's dilemma is something I have been thinking about for a while now, as I do have a bit of experience with it. The main question with the speedrunner's dilemma is ''How much time are you willing to lose in order to save it?'' Let me give an example.

Let's say you are speedrunning a game, in this case Sonic The Hedgehog. And you want to try a no clip glitch at the beginning of Marble Zone to pretty much skip the entire level. Now, by playing normally the stage would take 3 or 4 minutes to beat, but by clipping through the wall you can beat the stage in 30 seconds. But the glitch is notoriously tricky to pull off correctly and will likely take many attempts. You want to save as much time as you can so you try to clip through the wall, but you fail and fail.
Three minutes have already passed and you could have already beaten the stage if you just played it normally. At this point, the only way to stay on track with your speedrun is to successfully clip through the wall, however since it's really tricky to do, you still can't do it. A few more minutes pass and you still haven't done it. And then you die since you ran out of time.

And now we return to the original question. When is the point where attempting to do the glitch actually hurts your speedrun? When is the point where you should just stop attempting the glitch and just try to do the level normally? Is there such a point? You can always save more time by doing the glitch, but by wanting to save time you end up losing it.

Now, off course there are some people who are really skilled and can do the glitch in their first attempts and skip the entire stage, but even for those people, would it be better to just do the stage normally rather than risk wasting time?

This is something I think about a lot, and I still don't have a true answer. It really depends on how good/lucky you are at the game and there is no one size fits all answer.
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#2 2018-03-10 13:07:18

Tomahawk
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From: UK
Joined: 2015-02-18
Posts: 2,824

Re: Speedrunner's dilemma

Luka504 wrote:

It really depends on how good/lucky you are at the game and there is no one size fits all answer.

As you’ve said; the number and difficulty of shortcuts you decide to take depends on how much you’ve practiced.

But the point is that you do it over and over again, restarting as soon as you’ve lost too much time. That cutoff depends on how quickly (on average) you can finish the rest of the thing, and on what total time you’re aiming for.

I think a good speedrunner works incrementally, gitting gud at little parts of the run one at a time.


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#3 2018-03-10 13:25:54, last edited by LukeM (2018-03-10 13:28:46)

LukeM
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From: England
Joined: 2016-06-03
Posts: 3,009
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Re: Speedrunner's dilemma

I guess it mostly depends on what your goal is...

If you only have one shot at it (e.g. you're competing with other people to see who can complete it the fastest), then you'd go for the route with the lower average time, so if it took 5 30 second attempts on average, and the level usually takes 3 mins, then yes you'd do it, but if it took 7 then no you probably wouldn't.

If you are trying to beat a specific time (e.g. beat the world record / complete it in however many minutes) and you have many attempts, then you would try to find the route that would give you the best chance of beating that time, so if it was easier to cut down enough time there than it would be somewhere else, then yes you'd do it, otherwise no.

If you just want a low time though, and you dont have a specific goal, it depends both on how long you want to spend trying to get that low time, and how far it is through the game. If you just want the best possible time you can get, and you dont care how long it takes you then yes you'd take it, but if you weren't as dedicated you would decide how many attempts on average you would be willing to have to get that good score, then weigh up the probabilities to decide whether it is a viable way to do that or not. If its early on in the game, then I guess you're more likely to take it, as you can keep attempting it until one succeeds, only wasting a few mins each time. If its near the end then you would be less likely to do it, because if you fail then thats much longer that you've wasted.

Also, just thought I'd add, if you decide to attempt it, theres no going back, as the longer you spend doing it the better that route gets, and the worse the standard route gets.

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#4 2018-03-10 18:15:25

Bimps
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Joined: 2015-02-08
Posts: 5,067

Re: Speedrunner's dilemma

things that are basically tas only arent attempted in runs. for marathon runs some people might cut out risky ****, but for wr attempts you better go all in. practice the hard ****

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